Maggie McKay (Host): There's so much to learn as a new mom. One of which, and possibly the most important, is breastfeeding. In honor of Breastfeeding Awareness Month, our guest, Sheila Dedrick, RN and board-certified lactation consultant at Community Memorial Healthcare, is going to fill us in on what new moms need to know.

Host: Welcome to Wise and Well, presented by Community Memorial Healthcare. I'm your host, Maggie McKay. It's so nice to meet you, Sheila. Thank you for being here.

Sheila Dedrick, RN: Thank you, Maggie, for inviting me.

Host: Absolutely. Sheila, you're considered one of Community Memorial's go-to experts for all things related to childbirth, parenting and breastfeeding. So, can you tell us a little bit more about yourself, your background and your qualifications?

Sheila Dedrick, RN: Let me start off. Personally, I've been married to the love of my life for almost 45 years, and we have two daughters, one an RN and one is a school teacher. And we also have two grandchildren. Professionally, I have been an RN for over 44 years, and I've always loved everything about birth and babies. I worked in the obstetrics department for many years, including labor and delivery, the postpartum unit, and also a high-risk antipartum unit. Back when we had newborn nursery, I also worked in the nursery. We don't have newborn nurseries anymore. We do keep babies with their mommies. I did start the new parent resource center at Community Memorial Hospital, along with the Director of Maternal Child Health, Megan Rodarte, many years ago. I have my master's degree in Nursing Education and I'm certified also in hypnobirthing. And as you mentioned, I'm a board-certified lactation consultant.

Host: That is a full career. That sounds fascinating and continues to be. So, what are some of the benefits of breastfeeding for both baby and mom?

Sheila Dedrick, RN: There are so many benefits and they're always discovering new ones. But I'd like to start off with we put our babies skin to skin on mom as soon as possible after they're born because this encourages babies and mommies to breastfeed. And this is due to something called biological nurturing. So when babies are with mom, it activates their biological reflexes to breastfeed. Just like any other mammal, they find their way to the breast. And so right away, a benefit babies are getting is they're getting that first milk called colostrum. And this milk is like an immunization. It has all the right amounts of proteins, carbohydrates, and the right amount size just for that baby's little tiny tummy at that time. It also has the right amount of glucose, it stabilizes their blood sugars. And being with mom stabilizes their temperature. So if we look at that alone with breastfeeding, there's a huge benefit.

The other benefits mom is benefiting from at that point is the baby's making those movements and the baby's starting to get on the nipple, that is stimulating her uterus to do what it should do to prevent any hemorrhaging. And then moving forward, studies show that exclusive breastfeeding for the first six months provides the nurturing nutrients and energy needed for all of their physical and neurological growth and development. And beyond six months, it continues to provide energy and high quality nutrients. So, we know that breastfeeding is tailored to baby. The body knows what to put in it. So if a mom or a baby is exposed to any type of virus or illness, right away the breast starts developing antibodies to send that back to the baby to help protect the baby. It also ensures, of course, food security for the infants and increases mother-baby bonding. And it also decreases the chance of any female cancers. Babies benefit also with all reduced illness, including chronic illnesses. It's the best neurodevelopment of the infant for their brain growth and their brain nutrition. So as you can see, many benefits to breastfeeding.

Host: And another benefit, let's add, Sheila, I don't know if this is true or not, but when I was breastfeeding, I was never thinner in my life, and a lot of my friends have said that that was the case for them too. Is that true?

Sheila Dedrick, RN: Well, it's true from a point-of-view that every ounce of breast milk is right around 20 calories. So think about all the ounces that you're putting out in a day. So, it doesn't give you license to eat a bunch of junk food. But certainly, you have a lot of calories going out. And I was the same way. I often thought, "Gosh, maybe I should try to breastfeed a baby at my age. Maybe I could lose a little weight."

Host: Exactly. Oh my gosh. Well, when you tell us about all the benefits, what you just explained, it is like a miracle if you ask me. I mean that all those systems work together in unison and some first time moms may not know where to start when it comes to preparing for their breastfeeding journey. I remember I took a class at a place called the Pump Station, it's no longer there. But when do you recommend expectant mothers make the decision to breast or bottle feed? And who should they consult when they're making this decision?

Sheila Dedrick, RN: We do know that most moms do make that decision sometime during their pregnancy, and it's made because of maybe input from friends, family, or their partner or a health reason or a social reason is how they come up with their decision. And just like in birth, we all have our own experience. We have our own birth story, and we don't want our own birth story to interfere with somebody's else's birth story. So, we like for moms to look at themselves as individuals because like everything else they can get maybe some negative input from other people that might be well-meaning, but it might change the way they're thinking about things. So, we really recommend that you discuss any health issues with your provider. And also, you can discuss them with us here at the New Parent Resource Center. There are very few reasons why moms cannot breastfeed from a medical point-of-view, but those would be individual and some moms also will make a decision not to breastfeed because they hear some type of a story that was a negative story as I mentioned. So, we want to make sure that their best ability to make a decision on how they're going to feed their baby is based on education and where is a better spot to get that education than from a board-certified lactation consultant.

Host: Absolutely. And they have them in hospitals, right?

Sheila Dedrick, RN: We do over in the hospital. We have some board-certified lactation consultants on staff. Also, CMH is very unique because we are a baby-friendly hospital. And for those of you who don't know what that means, we have to meet a very high level of criteria, which includes all of our staff being trained in breastfeeding and how to help moms with breastfeeding.

Host: And what are the most important factors to consider when deciding?

Sheila Dedrick, RN: I would say the most important factors that you want to consider is what is comfortable for me and is this doable for me? Some moms feel that they do have that ability, and we do know that that's scientifically proven. In fact, one of the reasons that moms stop breastfeeding is they just don't feel that they're capable. And we're cheerleaders of sorts in that respect as well. But the other things to consider is what is best for me and my baby? While you're making that decision, there might be a social reason why a mom or a past medical reason. We don't believe that every mom needs to breastfeed if this isn't the best thing for her. What we want to do is encourage moms to breastfeed that maybe have some misconceptions. And once we clear those up, then of course, that's her decision. But we wouldn't want somebody to make a decision based on a misconception or lack of knowledge.

Host: And Sheila, if a mom decides to breastfeed, how can she give herself and her baby the best shot at successful breastfeeding?

Sheila Dedrick, RN: I mentioned skin to skin in the beginning, that is one of the very best ways to get off to a good start. And then keeping the baby with them, which we also do at Community Memorial, unless there was a health reason baby needed to be separated. Baby staying with mom gives mom all that ability to get to know her baby and to see when her baby is saying, "Hey, I'm hungry." In fact, back when they used to keep babies in nurseries in the beginning of my career, we only brought them out about every four hours, if you can believe that. And back in those days when we were bringing babies out every four hours, maybe baby was hungry at hour two, which would be very normal. But because it wasn't time to go out, by the time baby did go out, baby had already kind of shut down. So, that affects not only baby's ability to eat, but also mom's ability to make milk. Now, that babies get to stay with moms, they get to see, "Oh, my baby's starting to show what we call feeding cues. Let me put my baby up here where baby can get the milk, can go to the breast." And so, that alone is huge and offering babies the ability to go on is huge in them having successful breastfeeding. And that's also been scientifically proven.

The other thing that I would say to get off to a good start is to get that education, do get that support. We know that babies in the evening, especially from about 9:00 PM to 3:00 in the morning, in the beginning, in the first few days, they are ferocious eaters. And in a mother's mind's eye or a parent's mind's eye, they might be thinking something's wrong. But the baby is very smart because I always tell parents babies are very, very intelligent and they also have a lot of instinct and they got that call from Mother Nature that says from about 9:00 PM to 3:00 AM, the hormone that makes milk called prolactin is peaking. And the more that you eat, the more the prolactin will get in the receptor sites for a long-term milk supply. So, we allow our babies to do that. And it's a funny thing when parents think something is wrong. Of course, they think they need to fix it, which is very normal. But if they know this is normal what my baby is doing to make the milk supply, then they can roll with it. So, I would say that would be another thing, just to know like what is normal for babies to do and also how do we know that babies are getting enough? Because we would never say breastfeed at the sake of if your baby's not getting enough. We always want to give parents those parameters of, "This is what you look for to make sure your baby's getting enough."

Host: What are some of the most common challenges moms and babies face when breastfeeding? What can new moms do to prepare for these potential challenges, because they are there and what can they do to overcome them?

Sheila Dedrick, RN: The most common challenges that we see at the New Parent Resource Center is moms coming in with pain with breastfeeding or concerns about milk supply or a baby that isn't gaining weight adequately, and they all tend to go together. So, what the best thing that a mom can do is the moment that she notices that this is uncomfortable or painful, for her to check in with a lactation consultant who can evaluate the feeding, because sometimes it's just about the way the baby is on the nipple. And once we work with moms, I can't tell you how many moms come in here with painful breastfeeding. And we say, what is your pain level? And they might give a high number and pain levels on a scale of zero to 10, they might say, "Oh, it's seven or eight. "And then, we work with them with the latching. "And what's your pain level now?" "What pain? I'm not having any pain," and then they get to go home feeling empowered that I do know how to put my baby to the breast.

In terms of milk supply, when a baby is not latching correctly, they're not in the right spot to get the amount of milk that they would ordinarily get. So, those can go hand in hand. And then, it can also go hand in hand for mom's milk supply because our bodies are very special. When we remove milk, it wants to replace it. So if a baby isn't being the milk remover, then the body isn't making as much milk. So, I would say those are the three biggest things that we see people for. And then, there's all other types of things that come in. But that's what we are very highly skilled to fish out. And we create a plan when parents go home of everything for them to do to ensure that they have continued success.

Host: And if you can, should you have some spare milk in the fridge just in case the mom wasn't home or something?

Sheila Dedrick, RN: If mom is away, mom would definitely want to have milk available to feed her baby until she gets back if baby needs to be fed while she's gone, absolutely. And to ensure her milk supply, she would want to make sure she had ability to remove that milk if it was during a time that she would've otherwise been feeding.

Host: And how can partners and family members support successful breastfeeding? What role do you recommend they play in the process? Because they do.

Sheila Dedrick, RN: Family and friends are highly influential as well as the partner in mom's continued success. Remember I mentioned that they've done studies and that the higher efficacy, which means I can do this a woman has, she will overcome any obstacles and be successfully breastfeeding. A mom who has no efficacy at all, and many times that stems from a friend, it may be a mother, a mother-in-law, a sister or even a partner saying, "You know, you really don't have to breastfeed. We'll just bottle feed the baby," that they know doesn't do anything to help a mom feel better. It might make the person saying it feel better, but I know for a fact that moms come to me and they say somebody told them that and how upset it made them.

So, how can they support? Well, tell her what a great job she's doing, how strong she is, how fantastic she is and "Look at that milk that you got into the baby. Look at what a great job you're doing." So, really increasing her efficacy is so important. And then, meeting her other needs. Her need is not as sometimes us grandmas like to think we're over there to hold that baby. Well, that might make us feel better, but mom, she has an instinct and a need to have her baby with her. And what can you do for her instead is you are the circle around her. You're making sure that her needs are being met. Does she have plenty of water? Is she in a clean environment? In other words, "Oh gosh, you know, my sheets are so dirty. I wish somebody could change those for me. I don't have the energy right now because I'm taking care of a baby 24 hours a day." So, doing the shopping, the cooking, the meal planning, and thinking of that you're taking care of her while she has that unique and most wonderful time of her life to spend that time with her baby.

Host: Absolutely. And Sheila, for first time mothers, what breastfeeding or non-breastfeeding advice do you have for them?

Sheila Dedrick, RN: Breastfeeding advice is let your baby take the lead on when they're hungry. We say babies should eat at least eight times every 24 hours. That means they might want to eat 12 times every 24 hours, but you're letting them take the lead on that, also that you're ensuring that you do have a latch that's comfortable. When moms first start breastfeeding, it's not uncommon to feel the sensation of the nipple being tugged. We know that the nipple actually gets tugged about twice the normal size. So, could you imagine any body part of yours being tugged twice the normal size? So, that part does take a little while to get used to. However, it should be a tug and not feeling pain. There should never be any breakdown of the skin and no cracking, no scabbing, no bleeding. So, the normal tugging is normal. But if it's not, my advice is that they do call us. They reach out to us and they get an appointment with us so that we can help them straight away and not have them have to wait until things are getting worse rather than better. So, that would be my biggest advice.

Host: And what do you wish more mothers knew about motherhood in general?

Sheila Dedrick, RN: I wish more mothers knew to gather their resources around them and not feel like they have to do it all. I believe we live in a society where social media is just telling us what we need to look like, "Oh gosh, you had a baby. Are you not back in your pre-pregnancy clothes? Is your house not spotless? Is your baby not perfect?" And to enjoy who they are authentically as well as who their babies are authentically and give themselves grace, that they don't have to be everything to everybody all the time and to just enjoy themselves and this and their baby at this very short-lived time of their life that goes so quickly.

Host: Great advice. It's so true. I'd love to hear more about the Community Memorial New Parent Resource Center and how it supports mothers and babies and growing families.

Sheila Dedrick, RN: Yes. We have an incredible reputation in the community. We have pre-delivery classes and those pre-delivery classes center around the birth itself. We have prepared childbirth classes where parents learn everything there is to know about what's happening with their bodies, what happens in labor, how to stay nice and relaxed, and what happens after delivery. They also learn if they would like to have medication, epidural, they learn all about that. They learn in the part after delivery all about breastfeeding. They learn about what happens in the hospital after delivery and also all about their newborn. We also offer pre-delivery class hypnobirthing. And hypnobirthing, myself and one of my other educators are certified in hypnobirthing, that is a whole philosophy that we do have that ability to bring our mind to another place, and that birthing is completely normal. And when I mentioned the stories that we might hear from other people, negative stories about breastfeeding, as you know, how many negative stories have you heard in your lifetime from other women about birth? And so if you go into your birth experience with all of these in your mind, we know the subconscious minds can really kind of take over. So hypnobirthing, we actually deprogram people to allow themselves to really focus in on what their bodies can do and everything positive. And in fact, part of hypnobirthing, we give them a pin that says, "Don't tell me your birth story. My baby's listening."

Host: I love it.

Sheila Dedrick, RN: So, those are the pre-birth class. After delivery, I teach a curriculum called Our Babies Ourselves, and it's a Nate Week curriculum and we cover everything from our journey into parenthood as well as our babies to our physical, emotional, social. We do infant massage, the list just goes on and on. And that class is also extremely popular. And post-delivery, we have breastfeeding support group, which is at no charge. We also have well-mom emotional support, and that's facilitated by one of our social workers. We know that one in every five moms will experience some sort of postpartum mood disorder. So, we want to have that support for them as well. And then, I think our crowning glory besides all of those is we do over 1400 private lactation consultations a year. And we have private rooms, all of the staff that do those are also board-certified lactation consultants. And so, they have a wealth of knowledge and experience. And we even have special scales that can tell us the exact amount of baby is taking at the breast, if that's something that we need to look at. And just to let you know, we do surveys of how is your experience here. And I've never worked any place where they're all at a hundred percent positive. We do a wonderful job here at encouraging our mothers and parents and families to make the best decisions for them based on education rather than fear or misconceptions.

Host: That's impressive. It sounds like you have all the bases covered. And if our listeners would like to learn more or get in touch with you, where would they go?

Sheila Dedrick, RN: They could go to www.mycmhbaby.org and they will see a link for the New Parent Resource Center. On that link, they can see what classes we have available. And to register or to make appointments, they would call our baby line, which is 805-948-BABY, B-A-B-Y or 2229.

Host: Thank you so much for taking the time to fill us in on this crucial topic. I mean, you've taught us so much just in this short time. We appreciate it.

Sheila Dedrick, RN: Thank you, Maggie. I really enjoyed it. It was a pleasure.

Host: Again, that's Sheila Dedrick. If you found this podcast helpful, please share it on your social channels and check out our full podcast library for topics of interest to you. This has been Wise and Well, presented by Community Memorial Healthcare.