Michelle Moyal, DVM (Host): Hey everybody. This is the Cornell Veterinary Podcast where we deep dive into the discovery, care and learning that happens at Cornell University's College of Veterinary Medicine. I am your host, Dr. Michelle Moylal, Visiting Assistant Clinical Professor, Purina Veterinarian, and lover of all things chocolate.

Just wanted to put that out there. Last episode, I ate a peanut butter cup. I will not eat anything while interviewing my special guest today, who is, I'm very excited about talking to her. This is Dr. Sara Childs-Sanford, Director of Cornell's, Janet L. Swanson Wildlife Hospital. I'm very familiar with this Wildlife hospital.

We will talk about that in a little while. She's a fellow Cornell Vet alumni. Yes. Big red class of 99. Whoa. We put the class in there. Awesome. Putting it out there and also completed, right. I'm like, I graduated, right. She completed her residency in wildlife zoological medicine Cornell as well as a clinical researcher. She studies nutrition related disease and captive wildlife. I love this as someone who works in the nutrition industry right now and ways to improve her patient's health and releaseability, which I'm very excited to talk to you about. Welcome to the show, Dr. Childs-Sanford.

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: Thank you very much, Dr. Moyal. I'm very happy to be here.

Host: Yay. Well, how are you doing today?

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: Good.

Host: I love hearing that. It's Friday. It's Friday on our end. While we're recording, it may not be Friday when you're listening to it, and that's okay. Everyone take a collective deep breath because we've made it through another week and I'm very happy to say that and we're going to jump in.

Because I'm just really interested in what you do and how you've gotten to where you are as director. And I always our listeners, I don't know how many there are out there, but our few listeners, know that I typically ask someone's backstory, their journey. Like, how did you, could you share with us how you got to this point in your professional career?

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: Yeah, it's kind of a long and torturous journey, and I think as I share with students, everyone's journey is individual. There's no prescribed way to be, to get to where I am. But I did, for as long as I can remember, always want to be a veterinarian. And I did the typical things in high school.

I shadowed with a local large animal veterinarian and a small animal veterinarian. And then after my junior and senior years, I was lucky enough to get a job as a zookeeper at a very small local zoo where I grew up. And that to me solidified, not only that I wanted to be a veterinarian, but that I wanted to work with non-domestic animals. So.

Host: Wow. So even back then, you knew you wanted to work with wildlife and zoo animals and, wow.

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: Yeah, so really early and I had no idea what that meant and how I would do it. But I did know that I would have to become a veterinarian first. So that was my focus and my goal. And then, as I learned more about the profession, I, um took advantage of other opportunities. So, that's how I got my start anyway in zoological medicine.

Host: Ooh. Awesome. And we'll talk about some of those opportunities because I'd really like to share that, those things with young people. That's really interesting. And I think everyone, relates to this in the veterinary field, we're like, we had no clue how to do what we wanted to do, but we just had, we decided we wanted to go to vet school.

We knew we had to get through vet school, then we would figure out the rest. And so everyone out there, your path is not automatically paved. You don't have to have it all figured out, if you know you want to be in veterinary medicine as a doctor, and there are so many things to do after that, then we get you to vet school and you can figure out the rest.

So we have had some people that do wildlife here, that, that are wildlife doctors and scientists that study wildlife. What are the differences? If you could explain to our audience just some of the differences in being a wildlife veterinarian, like what you do, and maybe even being a companion animal veterinarian like I am.

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: Yeah, I, I think there's probably not as much difference as people think there would be. There are a lot of similarities and I really cherish, I spent some time in companion animal practice. That experience for me was very valuable in how I practice, and having that knowledge under my belt.

And I, I share that with students as well. I think some of the main differences are with wildlife medicine, our patients don't like us, so that's one main difference. Um.

Host: Mm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. I have come across that though in there are a few dogs and cats that have decided that they don't like me either, but

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: Yeah, so. One of them are friendly or want to be around us or want to be around people. So that's a big difference in the patients that we see. there, compared to companion animals, there's a lot less known, evidence-based medicine. We are constantly making progress in adding more evidence to zoological medicine, but it, there is a difference in the amount that's known, for the species that we work with because there are so many of them.

But other than that, I think a lot of it's very similar. And as wildlife veterinarians, we are often generalists in a sense. So we are not specialists in the sense of a cardiologist or an ophthalmologist, so not so focused. But I spent some time in emergency and critical care medicine, soon after I graduated.

And I feel like I've kind of circled back in that direction in that a lot of what we do at the Wildlife hospital is emergency medicine. That is something that I loved doing as a new graduate and I love doing it now too.

Host: That's awesome. You said so many good things. I'm going to try to kind of hone in on some of those things. I love that you mentioned you're a generalist, so some people may use the term general practitioner, right? Or GP. We have that a lot primary practice sometimes we use as synonymous with general practice, but essentially you're a generalist because you don't specialize in one organ system, but you're seeing all of these different species and you're managing any sort of injury. It could be an orthopedic injury, it could be their GI system, right, is not doing well, they're not eating. It could be their eyes that you're looking at. Right. So I do that on the small animal side. And when we were talking about some of these species, right? Like I may see a rabbit in practice, but this rabbit has probably been handled most of the time, right, by kids, by family members. When you are seeing a wild rabbit, it has not been touched. And so generally it has this, right, this feeling where it's trying to flight. It's flight. It's all flight. Some of it is fight, right? But, in the case of your patient. So that's really neat and I love that you mentioned that because I think the generalist is really important in veterinary medicine and so, oh, okay.

This is awesome. And another nod to your mentioning emergent and urgent cases. So I mentioned in the intro that I have brought quite a few animals to the wildlife center, and that is because I have found them suddenly injured. And then there's me in the middle of the street trying to rescue said animal to bring them to you, to be addressed, and taken care of.

But it is the same thing in general practice, right? Yes. We give vaccines. Yes, we may see, some what we call more routine things, but on any given day, I could deal with a dental emergency and then an animal that needs a splenectomy. So the variety of your day really can change.

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: Absolutely. Every day is different. Every day has new things. I feel like even now after I've been practicing for going on 30 years, that I see new things all of the time, which I love.

And so, yeah, it's, it's never dull. And it's always challenging. So I, I can't anticipate they will ever become bored with doing what I'm doing.

Host: Yay. Now, don't get me wrong, there were some times I wished I had a dull day. There were some times right. I, I don't mind action packed, but some days I'm like, wouldn't it be nice? But that's okay because that's what we're there for, right? We're there to, and again, it keeps us learning, which I love.

I think as a young student, right? I was like, oh, by 10 years in, I think I'll pretty much have a handle. I love talking to students about that. Now I'm like, oh, I'm almost 19 years in and every day I am like, I didn't even know that was a thing. And so, because we don't see it often enough, so if everyone's like, what do you mean veterinarians?

You're telling us you don't know everything. Everything is a lot. And especially like you working with species that haven't even been studied extensively. So, I know you don't have a typical day necessarily, but can you give us kind of a snapshot of what your daily activities look like?

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: Yeah. So, when I'm on clinics,

Host: So meaning she's working with our fourth year students, in the clinical

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: Yeah, I'm in the hospital, working in the hospital all day. And so, we arrive, we have, our first staff arrives early at 7:30 and I arrive shortly after that. And we have a lot of different variety of staff, but we all are working together first thing in the morning to check on our patients, assess where everybody is first thing in the morning, addressing critical patients and neonatal animals first, while treatments are being prepared, diets are being prepared for all of the different species that we have in the hospital. So everybody's working really hard to get those things done quickly. We move in to treat our patients and then, when that's all done, which this time of year takes quite a bit of the morning; we all sit down together, in our conference room and have our patient rounds. We also call this second breakfast because by that time it's a few hours later and we're starving. So we eat again.

Host: Second I support second breakfast. This team sounds like a good

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: Yes, yes, we always have food available. And we talk about every single patient in the hospital. This time of year that can be anywhere between 30 and 40 plus patients in the hospital.

We go through everyone. We talk about their diagnostic and treatment plan, what they need for that day, if anything, and then we order our plan for the day. And then, when whatever hours are left in the afternoon, we do all of those things. And that ranges from surgical procedures, to radiographs to new patient intakes. So all throughout the day, new things are coming in. And so we're dividing and conquering.

Host: Wow. So a few great things. One, veterinary medicine is a team sport. I say this all the time, we cannot work without our team, so I appreciate that. She mentioned this too, 30 to 40 patients is quite a number of patients. I want people to understand this and why it's even greater in your cases.

These patients may not want to be handled and they may be in such delicate, right? They may be so injured, right? And we have to handle them so delicately that even sometimes the stress of exams, now we see that as well. Sometimes the stress of exams can really like, make us very concerned about whether or not they will make it through, but we have to examine them, either minimally or you talk with your team and decide how much you will handle them.

And so I very much appreciate that you all are talking about this through the day. And then for everyone listening, she's got these 30 to 40 patients. They're still taking in new patients throughout the day. So that means if they have a surgical procedure, again, the team is working to take this patient in and, make sure that they're at least stable so doctors can look at it. That is a lot to handle.

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: A lot to handle. We have wonderful, we have incredible staff. Our LVTs are amazing. We have rotation students of course, so there's a lot of teaching happening during all this as well. We have students that we employ to work at the Wildlife Hospital that are also with us during the summer, during the day.

And we have house officers, so I have interns and residents that work with us. And so a lot of my job also is depending on how many people are present during the day, I'm often bouncing in between helping and teaching and sort of doing all these things with our house officers as well. But you're right, I, we do talk a lot about handling the animals we see and making sure that we are being very careful with how we handle them. Everyone is safe, the humans are safe, the patients are safe, and, that we are, it's a balance between addressing their needs in the moment and not pushing them over the edge when they are so ill or injured.

Host: Yeah, a great point to bring up is that she mentioned human safety. I know we are all veterinary professionals, but I may have benefit of the doubt of having a history where I know about vaccine status. Your staff and yourself may not know what this pet may have. It's not impossible. It's something that a human can get.

It's not impossible, right? So, so there are lots of hidden, I'm not going to say dangers, but hidden concerns that you all are being very aware of. In addition for those listening, LVT is our version of a licensed veterinary technician. It's almost our equivalent of a human nurse. Our veterinary technicians are the legs we stand on.

They do so many things and house officers, which she mentioned are interns and residents. That means they are veterinarians who have graduated from veterinary school that are doing additional study. They've been accepted into programs to do additional study, to learn more about zoological medicine and wildlife.

Or they're in process of becoming a board certified doctor, in this specialty. So that's really neat. So this is very involved. So not only that, you have to hit the ground running and you have to be mindful of your teaching. So that is a lot on your plate, just like a little good thing.

They had second breakfast. It's right. The food is the vital part of all of that. Agreed. And so, gosh. When I, because I've talked to some people involved in wildlife and sometimes, they're talking about being in like the Serengeti and different countries. You are doing a very different aspect of wildlife. I don't want our listeners to think it's all the same.

Right. It's obviously very different, so what made you go into this? Why here? Why this wildlife center? Why these species? What drew you in here specifically?

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: So I think that is a myth, to some degree, to some students thinking that if I want to do wildlife, I'm going to have to be hanging out of a helicopter with a dart rifle.

Host: Right, which is also a cool image, but not necessary.

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: So that is part of wildlife health and wildlife medicine, but that's not the only way you can be a wildlife veterinarian. I think looking back at my career, I've done all different aspects of zoological medicine, not necessarily the aquatics disciplines. So within my specialty of zoological medicine, there are four disciplines based on areas of practice. So one of those is zoo medicine. One is companion exotic animals. So our pets that are not domestic animals. Another is aquatic animal medicine. And then the fourth is wildlife medicine. So I haven't really worked in aquatics, but I have done all those other areas and, but wildlife medicine has really kind of, I've had contact with all along. When I did my small animal internship right after graduation, I chose the practice that I did because they allowed me to see wildlife on after hours. So when I was on my overnights, I was of course treating the pets in the hospital, but I was also on the side fixing box turtles and seeing geese and whatever rehabilitators would bring me. So, and I've done that throughout my career. When I first came back to Cornell in 2014, my appointment was 50% zoo medicine.

And 50% wildlife medicine, and then I eventually transitioned to a hundred percent just because overseeing our hospital, which was growing so rapidly, required all of my attention, and I think I was a little nervous back then. I was working with elephants and lions and things like that. I was like, what am I going to miss this having this opportunity to work with these animals from around the world and I haven't missed a beat or looked back.

I think the diversity of species and the unique things that we have right here in our local area is just tremendous and I'm very thankful every day to be working with these animals.

Host: That's so awesome. It certainly sounds like you, you found your place there and as I used to work in emergency medicine for many years and I also had the opportunity because I liked exotic animals. So I would see snakes and chinchillas and large birds and all sorts of things, turtles and things. So our future veterinarians out there can do some of this without specializing, and they could still see cats and dogs, but I didn't know that in this whole field that you're in, that you could kind of hone in on those four kind of divisions. So that's really interesting, including fish and things like that. And for everyone listening an appointment at, when you work at a veterinary school or an academic setting, you essentially have a contract, and that contract kind of tells you where you're spending your time, and so you will be appointed to a portion in like the clinical setting, like in the hospital seeing cases because we are clinicians here talking. And then other parts are doing all sorts of other things. Lectures and committee work and, all sorts of things which we're not talking about today. Because I'm here for the animal stories.

And you mentioned some cool animals. So I would like to know, can you share with us like one of, is there, like, if someone's like, tell me. Tell me a cool case. What is the coolest thing you've ever done? Now, you may not have one, and that's okay. Or maybe you have multiple cool things. I sense you probably have multiple cool stories, but if you had to pick one, is there a case that you share with people?

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: No. And I,

Host: I love She's this is not the first time I've been asked this question. It's such a hard question. and

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: I actually asked, some of our staff members this recently because I was like, why can't I think of why did single things not stand out in my mind. And I was surprised to find out that they feel the same way.

And I think that, we came to the conclusion that every day is new. Every day we see something cool. So it's not like we're kind of working along at the norm. And then blip, there's something really amazing that happened. We have these little blips all the time, and I think we are also all very passionate about what we're doing.

We love what we're doing, so we just have enjoyment every day with the things that we're seeing, even if they're the more common species, that we're seeing. So there's nothing that stands out. It's all very cool.

Host: Yeah, I'm going to turn this around. I, if you're ever, I appreciate that, because I think it's really important to appreciate the everyday, right? If you're at a dinner party or a party, do you ever share something? And it doesn't have to be cool. It could be. Sometimes I share, especially with students the day I was like, whoa, I never expected that dog vomited up 15 scarves. You know, like, that was a few years ago. And yes, it was. I think it was more than 15. It was like, yeah, it was a lot. It was a lot of bandanas, by the way. So do you ever share, do you have one of those just like, huh, what happened that day?

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: I feel like we have these discussions together as a group all of the time. We see things that are unique or surprising every single day it seems like. So, I guess I could give an example from this week. It's not a groundbreaking example.

Host: Yeah. We're not here to ground break anything with the top, we just want to, we just want a little bit into the, just open the blinds. We don't want to look in.

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: I will say that there are a lot of things that involve some type of excretion or things like vomit and things that we would talk about at staff dinner party, but probably not welcome it outside of the workplace.

Host: Yes. Audience. By the way, we have no shame. We'll talk about poop and vomit while we're eating. It's just not, it's not even a thing. You're

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: We do during

Host: You're welcome. Yes, yes, yes.

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: So,

Host: That's awesome.

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: So, for example, we had an eastern meadow lark, which is not a species we ever see. It probably could count on one hand.

Host: Is that a bird?

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: A bit, it is a bird. It's a grass bird. Uh, a ene bird. It's a small songbird type of bird.

Host: Perfect. Now she's speaking my language.

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: Yeah, it had trauma. it had a back fracture, but in the course of examining that animal, it had some, white lesions. So abnormal white structures all over its back and on its side, and they looked almost like webbing material. I got on my granny hobby glasses, so I could see, because I, couldn't see very well. And underneath these little structures were mites running around and we don't see birds, bird mites that produce webs.

So, I think they were,

Host: I'm upset. I'm upset. This sounds like a horror movie. I don't know how I feel.

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: We don't typically see, I think it was a spider mite and they shouldn't be on a bird. But anyway, I submitted them to the Animal Health Diagnostic laboratory here at Cornell for identification, which is a perk of obviously they could offer this to anyone, but we have this right down the street from us.

So I will be finding out what it is, but just a surprise, of something new. So.

Host: Stay tuned folks, and that is one of the benefits, right, of working at a facility like Cornell. She has just a few experts at the lab. We also have parasitologists that are amazing and so that, that's really neat. I'm kind of, well, I'll be waiting. I may email you later to just find out what that was. I'm both, I both don't want to know, but want to know.

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: Oh yeah. I want to know.

Host: It's that. Yes. And that's why you belong where you belong.

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: Yeah.

Host: And so we have this. That was awesome, by the way, that, I don't know why she said it's just like I just said, share that with you all. Yeah, she should. She should. Your research is all about improving the health of your patients, obviously while they're in your care.

What kind of things have you discovered in this work? Like have you looked at new protocols or treatments that you found, to have your patients do better, to improve quickly. Is there something you'd like to just share with us about that?

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: So we're always, most of my research now has transitioned to Wildlife specific research. And yes, I'm very interested in providing evidence to our practice, how we do things, and also improving our success rate in treating animals to make sure that when they are released back to the wild, that's always our goal, that they are, not only survive but are thriving, they're back to a hundred percent functionality. And so, I think, one of the studies that we've done, the research projects that we've done has looked at something as simple as how do we treat hawks or raptors that are emaciated. So in, the exact opposite of what is more common in companion low practice, where animals tend to put on weight and are overweight more optimal.

Our patients is have often been out there struggling for some time before they're found often completely emaciated or starving, and there's really a lot less literature about that aspect of nutritional recovery or nutritional treatment and animals. And so, looking at Redtail halks specifically that are emaciated when they come into the hospital, and what's the best way to address that nutritionally, and avoid any complications as they sort of re start to metabolically correct themselves and

Host: Recover. Gotcha, gotcha. That's really tough because how you may be able to treat them in the hospital really make their lives improve, but then kind of what happens back in the wild.

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: A lot of unknowns. Yes. As far as what happens to these animals when we release them. And so, we, there's a lot of opportunity in all the whole spectrum of clinical care to rehabilitation, to release of gaining information and evidence that helps us direct our energy and our resources in the correct way.

Host: Yeah, that's really cool. As someone who works in, she's very, very correct. As someone who works in the field of nutrition when it comes to cats and dogs, a lot of our animals actually, there is a big obesity problem in our companion animals are specifically cats and dogs that I'm talking about. And we often have to use diet to address that, right?

Because then these animals are at risk for things like diabetes and orthopedic problems with their bones. But you're essentially trying to help, you're using nutrition for the opposite to help them recover optimally. And by the way, this is not easy either, and I don't know if you deal with sometimes what we deal with, in cats and dogs. We can't just suddenly feed them a lot of food. Right. This has to be a process.

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: It does have to be a process, and they often don't want to eat either, so that is also part of the process.

Host: Yeah. So if you're like, oh, well that animal's really skinny because it was sick, just feed it a lot. We often have a lot of barriers to that. One, we can cause internal harm by feeding them very quickly, but two, now we have to overcome these barriers of them not wanting to eat, and then we have to figure out their underlying problems.

So it gets, it's a, sometimes it's a vicious cycle and it's very difficult to kind of get to the center of it. And so that's. That's really interesting work, but I'm glad you're doing it. I don't want birds to be starving, in the wild. Now you've shared with us some of your journey and what you do day to day.

I'm hoping there are students out there that are like, oh, great, I don't want to hang out of a helicopter and with a dart gun, and I would like to do wildlife medicine in any capacity. What would you say to those students if they're interested? Like, should they consider something special? Should they be aware of certain things, look into certain things?

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: Yeah, I think one of the things, we just started a wildlife specific clinical rotation, so fourth year students on their clinical rotations, wildlife hospital for two weeks. We started that three or four years ago. And, I want one of my main goals was to make this rotation as inclusive as possible so students didn't feel like I have to want to be a wildlife veterinarian to do this.

And so we, we have students coming through who want to do large animal medicine or, research only and all different areas of practice of veterinary medicine. And I think that, yes, there will be. There you are. You can specialize in wildlife medicine, but you don't have to. So in general practice, for example, you could also take in wild animals.

Host: I used to see them at like injured owls, sometimes smaller birds, some wild rabbits, things like that. Squirrels.

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: Yes. So we want to be teaching those basic things of how can you and your staff work safely with these animals to perform a basic physical examination and identify is what's happening and provide some initial treatment, and then maybe it needs to come to a more specialized place like the Wildlife Hospital, but providing that initial assessment and care any veterinarian should be able to do if they want to.

So, that's one thing I want to relate to students. But then as far as specialization in wildlife medicine, it is a journey. I think I, it's important to me that students understand that as a veterinarian, I would love for them to have a good, strong foundation in clinical medicine, and I do recommend that they do an internship and learn normal.

So working with companion animals in some way to sort of get their feet underneath them as a new graduate and learn normal things before they dive into the weird things that we see. But I think there's been the argument that wildlife veterinarians may, if they're working in the field, for example, may not do clinical medicine very often, so it's not as important for them to have a clinical background. I think exactly the opposite of that is true if they're only doing it two or three times a year. That is exactly the reason why they need a solid clinical foundation, because it all comes down to those isolated events and you're out in a field setting where you don't have the luxury of all the things we have in the hospital.

So you're strained in that respect. Your clinical skills are even more important in that. So you're going to want to have that one sample that you need for research or whatever you're collecting in that field setting or doing in that field setting. You want it to be successful in that time that you're working on that animal.

So, it is important to have that clinical foundation, whether or not they anticipate they'll be doing clinical work in the future. You never know where things are going to take you.

Host: And that's what I was going to say. 100% agree. Students everywhere, should you find yourself in veterinary medicine and you're in school and you're like, wildlife, I'm going to do horses. Why would I look at wildlife? One, you may change your mind. You may fall in love with wildlife medicine. That happens often, right?

We find a passion when we're in the hospital, on clinics, our fourth year rotations. So you may find something you love too. Handling small creatures and larger creatures, right? You do all sorts of sized creatures, but it is really important, understanding how to restrain and maneuver and use basic strong physical exam skills.

So I'm going to echo what she said. Getting a year after you graduate from vet school. A lot of us will opt to do something called an internship, especially if they think they want to specialize, use that internship. So I think sometimes we're like, just get through the internship because we want to specialize.

Who cares? Who cares for everybody who is not watching this? My hands are flying everywhere. Like I'm poo-pooing the internship. Don't poo poo the internship right. Put yourself in there, look at a neonatal kitten like you would examine a squirrel. Like all of these skills are very, very important. So I'm really, really glad you mentioned that.

Because I think that's really important.

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: Yeah. We do focus a lot on basic clinical skills. Our training, as you probably gathered from my description of our day, is a lot of hands-on, in the moment, this is what we're doing. And so, learning how to hold a syringe, do injections, how to give it, how to take blood. We're doing all this all the time, all day.

And so even though they're working on wildlife, the students are getting a lot of this basic technical hands-on experience, which goes across species and disciplines everywhere. So.

Host: Yeah, absolutely. So I have a few things that I really have been thinking about when it comes to wildlife because sadly, you know, I drive down the road, I live in the country and sometimes I'll see traumatic like wildlife on the side of the road and they're injured. And usually that's where I come in to grab them.

But some of them have passed away. And so I imagine that working on wildlife every day, you do have a lot of insight into what's going on in like our local ecosystems, the local environment. Are you seeing any trends in the cases, like I know you mentioned what you're doing research on, in those hawks, but are you getting, like what kind of information are you getting from these trends you're seeing in practice?

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: We do see a lot of trends. We have ebbs and waves of species that with migration and things, so we'll see an uptick in certain species around the year. But we all see, also see trends in disease. The majority of our patients actually present from of human influence. Then there are also disease trends, so infectious diseases that are occurring, parasitic diseases that are occurring.

So we're always looking for those trends and trying to not only identify those, but then do something with that information. We also collaborate with the New York State Department of Environmental Conservation's Wildlife Health Program here at Cornell. They're also seeing trends.

They sort of take in deceased animals, deceased wildlife, ay, so they're seeing trends and we're also seeing trends in the live animals that we take in. So we're communicating about what's, what we're seeing, what's going on so that we're all on the same page, which is a really nice collaboration to have.

But right now, for example, we're seeing an uptick in West Nile virus. So every few years or so, there's a another outbreak of West Nile Virus. This one seems a little bit unique. We often see it mostly in raptors. So birds of prey. This year we're seeing two or three times our annual caseload of Broadwing Hawks have come in, in the last two months.

And, many of them have West Nile virus, so it's a little bit different than the past years. We don't normally see Broadwing Hawks in this volume, so, but we're always watching. Some of these things we've published and they're very exciting when that happens. We discovered an emerging virus in porcupines here through the hospital.

Host: What.

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: Yeah, we are actually, I will say, a lot of our publications have come out, have been on porcupines, so we are kind of like porcupine experts, which I'm happy to be.

Host: Yep. I'm happy to talk about this. Porcupines need care too, everyone.

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: They do. And I love to use porcupines as an example. So in a lot of since they can be viewed as pests, people don't like them because they are rodents. They may damage wooden structures that they chew on, for example. They are fairly common. But the diseases we see then the common species, we should know about because they could be influencing other species that are less common or be something that's transmissible to humans, for example.

So, all of these animals that we see are important in some way, for that respect. So, yeah, but we are always watching for trends and we are all always seeing and on alert for new things.

Host: Yeah, and again, everyone listening, sometimes I'll talk about things like One Health, but essentially when we talk about things like this in ecosystems, they, they really can impact humans and obviously human can, the human world can impact our wildlife. And so when they're studying trends and doing research, a lot of times they can have impact on the human side, which is what I love about veterinary medicine.

Because like she said, some of these diseases can be transferred to humans as well. So we have to be very, very careful. So I'm really glad you mentioned that. And so if anyone listening is like me who maybe has brought you a mouse that was injured, that's right. People I drove to the wildlife center twice.

This was twice, actually, this was two separate mice. Yes. If they find an injured animal, obviously I'm a veterinarian. Everyone, I'm just, I'd think.

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: A mouse, so.

Host: Right. I have some knowledge. I grabbed the mouse with some gloves, right? And I brought, or they see an abandoned baby animal because I did have that as well.

I had a fawn. I made sure to watch it for actually a couple of hours because sometimes I didn't want mom to like come back. So what should someone like me, or not a veterinarian or veterinary professional, what should they keep in mind when they find these injured animals? What

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: Sometimes it can be difficult to tell what is normal and what needs help. Sometimes things are normal and they're brought in, and maybe shouldn't have been. But, it's never wrong to reach out to someone for help and that could easily be a local wildlife rehabilitator. And, they always have great advice to give and they may be actually be able to assist whatever's happening.

Of course, we take these calls all the time at the Wildlife Hospital and help people to discern what, what's happening and what to do about it. I think it's also important to remind people to be safe. Don't get hurt while you're running out onto the road, or when you're trying to handle an animal, to put it in a box, for example.

We don't want anyone getting hit by a car or bitten, or scratched or any of those things. So, we are often giving that type of advice as well and, how to do this safely for the animal and to keep yourself safe. So, but yes, always good task.

Host: I really, so all of you listening out there, I appreciate you animal lovers because I probably pull over once a week. Not going to lie. And it's dangerous. You have to be very careful, and that's just the danger of like cars and things, which she's absolutely right. Remember, these animals can carry diseases and we do not want you to get bitten or scratched, and so.

Being able to call and have a resource of someone who can guide you through figuring out, well, one, if they should be brought in because maybe it is in fact normal or two maybe how to handle them, when you do have to bring them in is really important. So great resource. And so kind of on the opposite side, because I always hope they're not hurt, like these animals are not hurt.

How? Like how do we tell people to avoid wildlife. I mean, not avoid, but like cohabitate with them, coexist with them so that we don't hurt them and they end up at your hospital. Are like, are there basic things that our listeners can keep in mind if they want to be like good ecological neighbors to our wildlife?

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: Yes, absolutely. So, as I mentioned, many of our patients are in the hospital out of some type of interaction with humans or human structures. And so there are a lot of things that we can do to help those things. Don't use pesticides or chemicals in your yard. Build wildlife friendly yards.

So use native plants, things that flower and bury, and have fruits, for example. Use if you have big windows, add things to your windows to

Host: I've had to do that. Bird tape. I've had to tape my windows because I was bringing you guys injured birds and I have to thank you for mentioning that the tape works and now I occasionally have a bird that gets stunned and like hits and I have, I literally have boxes on the side that I put them in. I allow them just to recover in a dark, warm place and then I re-release.

But that bird tape, thank you for mentioning that. That is

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: Yeah. And the lab of Ornithology here at Cornell has amazing resources to teach you and, give you direction on where to get those things. So to.

Host: And a great app everyone.

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: Slow down when you're driving, especially closer to dawn and dusk when animals are moving. You can carry a pair of gloves and a towel and a cardboard box in your car if you'd like. Do not use lead shot or fishing gear.

Host: Oh, good to know. We have a lot of hunters and fishers out here and I'm sure everywhere else there's a lot of people who are doing that for sport and even just as a hobby.

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: Please use non-lead alternatives. Use Rodenticides, find other methods of rodent control because those things often cause relay toxicity where the animals that eat those rodents then become poisoned by the, by what we're poisoning the rodents with. So that's, a good thing to remember. Keep your cats inside.

And that's safest for your cats, but also safer for wildlife. And, I think that in general, pay attention to what's happening. Spend time outside, notice what's around you, the wildlife that lives right around you. Be aware of it. Develop a connection to it. I think be interested and find out about it, and take that interest to the next level and being aware of what's happening locally, statewide and federally with the policies that are being implemented or are what you can do about that. And, donating, donating to your local wildlife rehab organization. Our hospital, operates largely on donations. So, if you have an interest in wildlife, supporting those who care for wildlife in that way by making gift.

Host: Oh, all great suggestions. One, everybody go outside. Sometimes you just need 10 minutes of breathing fresh air, it actually can help your life and longevity. They're actually doing a bunch of studies on just getting outside, just walking for a few minutes and breathing in fresh air. Good for your brain, good for your body.

But all of these other things to be mindful of a couple of things. We are not arguing, I'm not having an argument here about whether or not cat should be indoor outdoor. What we are stating is cats that are outdoors will attack birds, will attack other animals, right? So if you're like, great, they would be a great mouser.

Well, other things could be happening. And what she was mentioning about like things like rat bait and mouse bait. Toxicity, is that yes, you're aiming to get the mouse, but the mouse will eat the poison, and then before it passes away, another animal will eat it and then can be affected by it.

So then you may be inadvertently affecting our wildlife population. So thank you so much for pointing out all of those important things.

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: And these are all things that we see on a regular basis, so.

Host: On a re. Wow. Okay. Yeah. So we can have big impact by making smallchanges in our home life, to be quite honest. By the way, pollinator plants and native plants are amazing. Sitting outside and watching all of the birds do their thing and that little, the bees doing their thing is fantastic. So also for your mental health, everyone.

I really appreciate you talking through all of this stuff. It's very interesting stuff. And now my, or our listeners here at the Cornell Veterinary Podcast, now I'd like to ask a few, just like, just a few lighter questions at the end. Just things so they know we too are human beings and we are here as veterinarians, but we're not only veterinarians. Right. So, I would love to know, do you have any hidden talents or hobbies that you can share with our listening audience?

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: I don't know if I have anything hidden. I also have three children, so I don't currently have any hobbies really, unfortunately. But, in the future, I would like to resurrect some hobbies that I used to have.

Yeah. So, I used to play the piano and the flute. I would like to do that again. And I used to, love art and used to draw and paint. So, in my summers in grade school, I took summer school, on purpose for some reason, not out of necessity. So I took art classes in that way. So I, do enjoy that. So I would like to do that again someday and, draw animals, maybe wildlife,

Host: Or she could draw anything else. That's very, I like that she's very musically and artistically inclined. That's awesome. The only thing I do is listen to music. I don't partake. I'm not really artistic. That side of my brain does not work. And that's okay everyone. Is there something that you can share with us that maybe a lot of people don't know about you?

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: There's probably a lot that people don't know about me because I'm a pretty private person, but

Host: And here I am being like, tell us. Tell us now. Tell us about yourself.

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: There's really not anything exciting either to share. So, I was encouraged to be a, professional flutist when I was in high school. I did not elect to do that, and I'm happy

Host: Our gain. offense. No offense to the music world. That's really cool. Okay. When you are reading research or writing research, is there music playing? I ask this a lot. I feel like this tells us a lot about a person.

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: No.

Host: Yeah. So, okay. No judgment here, because when I have to get in the zone, I am in silence.I am in silence. So, I respect that decision very much.

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: Yeah, if there's music, it's very quiet,

Host: Gotcha. If you do. She does have three children. So is it quiet? I'm not sure. I'm not sure if it's ever quiet, but you never know. She could be at the hospital, which also I'm sure is never quiet. When you do choose to listen, do you listen to something specific?

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: I don't, I like a lot of different types of music, with the exception of probably country music. I'm sorry. I don't really like that and I don't really like, like headbanging heavy metal. But anything else I'm game for. Right now my kids are sort of on an eighties rock streak, which is right up my alley as a,

Host: Awesome.

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: I'm down with that and, I'm happy to share music listening.

Host: Teaching those kids. I love that too. That's awesome. I'm amending a que I have asked many a person because we are all science people about Star Trek versus Star Wars. But I'm going to amend it because the right answer, everyone is Star Wars. The answer is Star Wars. I keep getting a lot of Star Trek people. Wait, are you a Star Trek person?

Sara Childs-Sanford, DVM: No, I'm absolutely Star Wars, but I will say space is not where it's at. Middle Earth is where it's at. So If I have to choose though, I will choose Star Wars.

Host: You heard it here, people, middle Earth is where it's at. That was fantastic. I'm going to end there. Mic drop, right. Pen drop. thank you so much Dr. Childs-Sanford. You have been fabulous to talk to. It's just been really interesting. Thank you for sharing all of your knowledge with everyone listening. Be kind to our wildlife or just start to be cognizant of our wildlife and those around you that maybe are not human and larger. Just start thinking about those things and get outside because it's good for you. Thank you for joining us and thank you all for listening to the Cornell Veterinary Podcast. Remember to like and subscribe and we will see you all soon.