Michelle Moyal, DVM (Host): Hey, everyone. Welcome to the Cornell Veterinary Podcast. You know how we do here, we're diving into the care and learning that happens at Cornell University's College of Veterinary Medicine. I am your host, Visiting Assistant Clinical Professor—I need a breath, because that was a lot of words—Dr. Michelle Moyal; also, hopefully, your favorite Purina veterinarian and, might I add, obsessed watcher of the Olympics. Don't think it's done, folks. Because the Paralympics start on March 6th. So, I'm very, very excited. I've been like glued to the TV.

Today, I am so happy to welcome our guest. Our guest today is Mikaela Frost, our very first LVT. So, LVT or licensed veterinary technician, the legs we stand on in veterinary medicine, by the way. They are our support system, veterinarians everywhere. I'm so excited because she's appearing on the show. She's our first LVT to appear on the show. And this is something we've talked about for a long time. So, it's wonderful that she is here to join us and make it happen.

You know how I'm giving you the bio on everyone. Let's talk Mikaela. Mikaela works as an LVT in—well, actually, she's worked in a few areas of the large animal hospital at Cornell, which is also very, very cool. So, Mikaela Frost is our LVT who has worked in, I want to say, large animal emergency initially, then transitioned to surgery, and then became a supervisor of other technicians. So, I really do want to discuss that path as well at the Cornell University College of Veterinary Medicine; again, our large animal hospital. She's also the chair of the LVT Internship Committee and the Co-Chair of the LVT Preceptorship Committee. That's a lot of words, we'll ask her about that. We're going to talk about all of the things in detail. And you've been at Cornell since 2017, doing all of those things I mentioned. So, welcome to the show, Mikaela. Thank you for joining us.

Mikaela Frost, LVT: Yeah. Thank you for having me.

Host: That was cool, I was like rambling, but it's because I'm so excited. And my listeners know this already, I'm a little bit of a talker. So, I always, always start off by asking people, "How the heck did you get here?" So, did you know when you were young, you were like, "Yes, this is what I want to do?"

Mikaela Frost, LVT: I think like many people say—first of all, I did not know that specifically a veterinary technician is what I wanted to do. But like most, you grow up and, "Oh, I love animals. I knew I wanted to do something with animals." So, that's kind of I feel like everyone's back story in vet med. But specifically, for me, Girl Scouts kind of accidentally launched my career for me. Because when I was about 10 years old, I did a volunteer project for Girl Scouts where I volunteered at kind of a pretty rural local veterinary clinic.

And before that, you know, I thought if you loved animals, you became a vet. That's just what you did. That was the only thing in that world, or you weren't in the veterinary world. But when I spent time at that clinic, I learned what an LVT was and how specific and distinct that role was from the veterinarian. And that kind of opened my eyes to this field. Again with the combination of that and growing up, loving animals and being surrounded by horses, everything kind of fell into place. But Girl Scouts was it for me.

Host: So, you're telling me Girl Scouts does more than just provide the delicious Thin Mints that I buy so many boxes of every year?

Mikaela Frost, LVT: They do.

Host: Is that what you're? That's amazing. For those of us who are listening, because I hope we have some young listeners that are also interested in animals, but maybe they don't think veterinarian medicine, like as a veterinarian is for them, could you tell them what is a licensed veterinary technician?

Mikaela Frost, LVT: Yeah. A licensed veterinary technician is someone who has gone to school and is a veterinary professional, just like a DVM, but they have a little bit of a different education, but are still a credentialed person. So typically, I would say up until recently, most technicians have gone through an associate's degree versus where, you know, they're getting a lot of information more around nursing care and treatment of patients rather than in depths of like diagnostics and treatments like the vets do. But they're getting all that jam-packed in like a two-year program.

More recently, they've developed bachelor programs for veterinary technicians, which is a little more immersive, or sometimes kind of branching into other areas outside of nursing care, whether that's management or anything like that. Whether you're in a specialty hospital like Cornell or in a general practice, they're kind of the backbone, that are performing all those procedures.

And often, honestly, they're kind of the bridge between the veterinarian and the client or the veterinarian and the patient, just making sure that the patient is being cared for and everything that, you know, the veterinarian prescribes is happening. And also, sometimes being that communication point for the owner to kind of make sure that they're aware and involved with what's going on with their animal in the hospital as well.

Host: I love the way you described that. So, she said a lot of really important things. DVM is a doctor of veterinary medicine. So, we have this role, right? The veterinarian. And then, we have almost our equivalent. It's not the same. I'm using it because it's close. Everyone listening, human nurses don't be upset. LVTs, don't be upset. It's very similar to human nursing. Not exactly the technical skills because, wow, you work on a lot of species, you're doing a lot of things. But I just want to have people have something in mind when they're trying to think about this position. And what she said was they can enter a two-year associates program through a college, or even now a four-year, where you can even get more experience about practice management and all these other things, which is incredible.

But the licensed veterinary technician, when I say they're the legs we stand on—and I know she mentioned this—they do so many things in practice and we'll talk about what a day looks like for you, Mikaela. But I know for me, I'm very lucky to have worked with some, I mean, fantastic LVTs that, one, taught me many things when I was a young veterinarian, and now—who are we kidding? Literally taught me the hands-on skills, supported me when I was talking to clients. And then, you have this other component that maybe some people don't realize. Like as a doctor, I would love to talk to every client, but sometimes we can't. We're running around and doing all these things. Same thing for you, but you can be that bridge and often are for clients, kind of telling them what the doctor wants to do.

So like, really, you are our connection to the client in many instances when we can't be. So, I like really, really appreciate that. That was a lot of words. But it was a lot of schooling. So, credentials, again, she had to not only pass this program, but pass an exam, right? So, we don't get out of a test.

Mikaela Frost, LVT: Yeah. So like not only are you going through a pretty extensive program, which if you do look up the veterinary technician programs online, there are quite heavy caseload wrapped up into those two years, but you're also passing a national license exam, which is pretty difficult to go through, but obviously necessary and kind of gives us the background that we need to be able to say, "This is what I'm qualified to do as a licensed veterinary professional here in this hospital." And I think that helps the owners understand that a little bit more as well. And the role we play in the care of their animal when they're here.

Host: Agreed. Agreed, agreed, agreed. So, let's say for you who works and did work extensively in a large animal hospital, what did a day—I can't wait for you to share this—what did a day look like for you? Actually, could you describe an emergency and then a day in surgery?

Mikaela Frost, LVT: Yeah. So, that's what's kind of like wild about veterinary medicine, especially here, is like my day to day is so different to anyone else's day to day. And like you just described, my day to day when I was in ECC in nursing care is very different than what my day is now, at times. So when I—

Host: ECC being emergency and critical care, for everybody listening.

Mikaela Frost, LVT: Yeah. So when I started here at Cornell in 2017, I was in emergency and critical care and nursing care, and I worked evenings and overnights. And I did that for about four years. So, kind of that day started anywhere between 4:00 PM or 5:00 PM in the afternoon to sometimes 10:00 PM at night. And then, I would either get out at 3:00 AM depending on my shift or eight 8:00 AM the next day.

So, in general, it's still kind of consisted of the same, you know, you come in, you round with the technicians, just like doctors do, that are leaving for the day to get kind of the important updates of the cases. And then, you start making a triage list in your head of the things that need to be done for your shift. So, not only in the hospital do we have quite a lot of inpatients that need continuous care, whether it's procedures or they have some sort of treatment every two hours. But we're also intaking emergencies in the evening and overnights as well. So, that's kind of the evening hours, are the hot hours to get emergencies. So, my evenings and nights were filled with kind of being pulled in a bunch of different directions of making sure those treatments were getting done, and also helping to triage and stabilize emergencies that came in.

And one important thing I like to point out here as well in the large animal hospital is those technicians are the frontline during those hours. So at about 4:30 PM, a lot of people leave from the day, and that includes eventually the clinicians, all the DVMs in the hospital. So, we are, you know, first-line to see if there's any of those small changes that are happening with the patients before they become emergencies, so that we can notify the DVM and say, "Hey, I have this concern." And they'll come in if needed and they will come in with the emergencies. But it is a lot of responsibility on those technicians.

Host: That is a lot. I mean, and I want everybody to picture this. They are there in the wee hours of the night. Everybody is getting home, other people are getting home from work, seeing their animals and going, "Something's wrong." So then, they rush to the hospital. And then, not only does she have to make sure that the very Ill—because remember she said critical care—that very ill animals are getting their treatments every two hours and those two hours are like these treatments don't just take a few minutes. These are very large animals and they're running around doing that. Then, they get interrupted and they have to triage, so they have to figure out what's going on with an animal, help get them stabilized, especially if they're very sick or if there was a very severe accident, she's jumping in. Then, she has to go back to treatments and finish things, or maybe she trades with another person who does treatments while she manages something else. This is not an easy juggling act, and this could be a life or death situation.

And then, not only that, she has to know animals so well that she is looking for small changes that might make her concerned enough to call a doctor to say, "Hey, we have something that could be a big deal." So, this is not an easy undertaking by any means. I want to make sure everybody knows that, because this is a big deal.

So, okay. Wow. That was a lot. And as a former emergency doctor who also did overnights, it is wild how some nights could be just like so many appointments and some nights were like a little bit more quiet. I didn't say that to a live ER. I just said sometimes. And then, you were in surgery. So, what did a day there look like?

Mikaela Frost, LVT: Yeah. So, days in surgery were a little bit more predictable. And I liked it in a very different way. I'm a very organized and—

Host: Oh, I love that word.

Mikaela Frost, LVT: I want to say cleanly person. You know, I like everything to be in order, very tidy, and that's what the operating room is. So while there was sometimes schedule changes or an emergency surgery popped up, it was still a pretty predictable day that, you know, there's only so many surgeries you can get done in a day.

So, it was much more relaxed in a way, moving from ECC and nursing care to the operating room where I'd come in in the morning. We'd get our list of surgeries for that day, whether it changed from the previous day or not. And then, you set up for all of your cases and kind of organize what rooms they're going to go into.

And then, the big part, you know, of the technician's role in the operating room is really helping to induce the animal. So, we're sometimes dealing with a small farm animal, which is equivalent to the size of a dog like a goat.

Host: Like a goat. Yep.

Mikaela Frost, LVT: And that's like, you know, very similar to small animal.

Host: On my list. One day.

Mikaela Frost, LVT: Yes, not too intense to induce, all the way up to inducing our horses, which is much more involved, and honestly much more of a kind of dangerous situation. So, it's really important to have people trained and know what they're doing that do this every day. So, we would help induce the patient, get them positioned on a table, which sounds super simple. But when it's a thousand-pound animal, it's pretty hard.

Host: Yeah, right. Exactly.

Mikaela Frost, LVT: Yeah. And once we get that done, we were always responsible for getting them prepared for their surgical procedure. So, that clipping and prepping them, moving them into the operating room, sterilely opening everything in the operating room. And then, you know, assisting the doctors from there. So, pretty routine for me in there. As far as, you know, you saw different surgeries every day. But it was the same concept of like induction, clipping, and prepping, opening supplies.

Host: Yeah. Again, for those of you who may not be familiar, even with surgery on the human side, this is very similar. I think you probably have your hands in a lot more things, where on the human side it's kind of a little bit more compartmentalized, right? There might be someone in the operating room specifically, and then someone in anesthesia helping.

Inducing means essentially she's in with this animal, they're giving drugs to help sedate and calm the animal and prep them for anesthesia, and then give them the drugs that they need for anesthesia. And then, that can involve a breathing tube and hooking them up to the machinery. And then, just moving this thousand-pound animal so it's properly positioned on a table. I'm saying this like, wink, wink, this is not very easy. So, they're in the right position for the specific surgery that her doctors are doing. Then, she has to shave the pet and like prep them, meaning make the surgical site all sterile. So, just because this is large animal doesn't mean that in the operating room, suddenly it's like just a free for all, we're just grabbing tools. Things are still very what we call aseptic and sterile. And by the way, even if a veterinarian—there are veterinarians and teams of technicians that do this in the field, like outside in fields, they're still using sterile tools and they're preparing everything to make sure that the surgery is very clean, because we want these animals to do well and not have infections. So, just that, and then like after they're done, she has to also help wake up this thousand-pound animal, right? So, you have your hands in a lot of places.

Mikaela Frost, LVT: We are fortunate in this specific hospital in the large animal portion to have anesthesia technicians who specialize in large animal and do help us with the induction process and the recovery process.

Host: Great. Awesome.

Mikaela Frost, LVT: But one thing that's, you know, something to point out that's a difference even in between this hospital, between small animal and large animal, is the surgery technicians and large animal are covering all surgical services. So if a medicine patient needs a procedure, whether that be imaging, like a CT or x-rays under anesthesia, whether it's a soft tissue, foreign body or mass removal, orthopedics, a fractured leg, like we have to know and do all those procedures, where a lot of places are a little more specialized and they only do dental procedures, they only do orthopedics, things like that.

Host: Got it. Yeah. So like, on the small animal side, there might be a technician that just does orthopedic procedures, then they know the drill, they're doing that. But you could be called into an emergency procedure, so you have to be prepared for everything, basically. So, that's really nice. And one thing I want to make sure I highlight to everyone, so yes, she has her hand in everything, but I really appreciate that she mentioned collaboration, right? Because we have this anesthesia team that is with her because both going into anesthesia and waking up from anesthesia can be very dangerous times for large animal and for small animal. So, we want to be really careful. More eyes and more hands and all these experts helping is such a great thing for patient care. So, I really appreciate that you mentioned that.

And so, I think—I'm hoping, actually. I'm going to rephrase—I'm hoping that people heard what you just said and really understand how important that your position is in a hospital, no matter what, small animal, large animal. Is there something that people really don't know about being an LVT that you want to be like, "No, that's not what we do." like, do you ever get like—because sometimes I think, even as a doctor, people will be like, "Oh, that's so cute. You just give shots to like kittens and puppies." And I'm like, "Oh, whoa, I wish it was that sometimes." I mean, it is that sometimes. But is there any misconception or something that people don't know about technicians that you'd like to share?

Mikaela Frost, LVT: I do think there's a lot of misconceptions. Try trying to narrow it down to—

Host: I got her with that one. There's too many.

Mikaela Frost, LVT: Yeah, to a few. But I think, honestly, a lot of people do think that we—I don't want to downplay the role of an assistant or anything like that, but of the times that's what people see us as, is an assistant to the veterinarian. And in their eyes, that means that we're restraining or holding onto the patient for them, maybe doing some client communication, taking the animal for a walk or a jog for the procedure.

Host: Or they might not even know that you had to pass through this rigorous program and pass a test for this. They think maybe you're just like just there doing the job.

Mikaela Frost, LVT: Yep. And in reality, a lot of the time, I think the owners are shocked when they sometimes realize when they come to pick up their patient, you know, that you're the one who did the bandage change on their horse's wound, or you're the one who passed that nasogastric tube into the horse's stomach. Sorry, all my references are large animals.

Host: That's appropriate.

Mikaela Frost, LVT: but I think that's pretty shocking to people that, you know, especially in a specialized teaching hospital, there is so much that the technician is doing that really the question is like, "What are we not doing? What are we not allowed to do?" And it's not just taking taking the horse for a walk when it needs it.

Host: Right. Yeah. On the small animal side, they're not just taking the dogs out to go potty.

Mikaela Frost, LVT: Yeah.

Host: A lot of people will say it like that. Well, they just take the dogs out to go potty. But no, there is a lot. And actually, a lot of these are—there are some regulations and rules based on state, right? There are some technicians that, at least on the small animal side, can do surgery, like certain procedures, And so, it just goes state by state. And what I hope everybody listening is really focused on is that she does a ton of things and there are things that you might not even think of, and there are things you might have only associated with a veterinarian. And there's this world out there with amazing people like Mikaela, who are again supporting patient care in the best way possible.

We talked about emergency, we talked about surgery. So, let's segue into your—because you are a leader and you are a supervisor. What does your day look like now? Because we also mentioned you are in these training programs. So, can you tell us more about your now and these training programs, like, what your now looks like?

Mikaela Frost, LVT: Yeah. I think I'll start with what my day looks like now in general, and then kind of lead in the specifics of the programs. But I'm back on the floor is what we like to call it. So instead of being in the operating room, I'm out in the barns again and doing a role similar to when I was in emergency and critical care and nursing care. However, it's during the daytime now. So, it looks a little different. And I'm managing a team of about 12 other people who work on the floor in different specialties, and things like that. So, to get really specific, honestly, my day sort of starts—I get here a little bit early and try to answer some emails and important to-dos that I need to do for that day.

And then, I jump into technician rounds in the morning, which is with my team. And then, we kind of split up from there to make sure that eight o'clock treatments are getting done. Like I said, even through the day, we have treatments every two hours. So, our fourth year veterinary students on clinics are responsible for 8:00 AM treatments, but they usually need a lot of assistance. And, you know, we're there to educate them. So right after rounds, we're helping them finish those treatments while we're simultaneously thinking about and getting instructions from DVMs on these specific services of, you know, what's coming in for the day, and what might need to be set up for those procedures, what procedures they want to do on inpatients throughout the day, what things are going home, and what we need to get prepared for them to go home.

And so, we're immediately kind of jumping into this day where you're triaging a bunch of different tasks asked of you, as well as emergencies coming in and your treatments every two hours. So, my job is to not only help with those procedures and tasks, but also organize a day and delegate things to different people to make sure everything gets done. So, we definitely feel like we're being pulled in a hundred different directions throughout the day, but we are trained to make sure, you know, that all those things get done and how to triage those appropriately.

And on top of all that, I am always wearing my management hat. So, I like to consider ourselves people leaders here instead of supervisors per se. But I could be pulled off the floor at any time for a meeting, needing to have kind of an urgent one-on-one conversation or just address like any other concern that comes up in the hospital, whether it's a light bulb is out and, you know, that's my job to make sure I articulate that to somebody in the hospital. So, my days are pretty busy and chaotic. And you can really go in any other direction. And then, I'm also managing other programs on top of that.

Host: And before we jump into the program, again, this is a lot because I think one thing to manage like your own responsibilities, like if you have a list for the day, but you're also trying to manage the direction these 12 people go in. And for everyone listening, rounds, essentially, is everybody gets together as a group. They're updating them on all the patients they can have in the hospital, which could be many, and they have to know their health status.

And then, on top of it, they have doctors being like, "Oh, by the way, I'm going to add this procedure today," or "Oh, that patient did better than I thought. It's going to go home." And now, not only are they managing these other sick patients in the hospital, they have to prep these additional procedures or potentially getting them ready to go home. And they're helping to teach our fourth-year clinical students, right? They're ready to help them with treatments, and then they kind of add guidance in other ways. The students might have questions. So, that's a lot. And then, they get pulled away for meetings. I don't know what I would do with that, because I like order and I would be very fixated on the stuff I have to do.

And so, you decided you wanted less work—wink, wink, just kidding. And now, you're involved in these programs. So, what programs are you—and I know I mentioned it in your bio, but can you tell us a little bit about these programs?

Mikaela Frost, LVT: Yeah. The big ones I'm a part of all kind of started, because I'm really passionate about the education of people, which originally kind of started as I knew fourth-year DVM education was a part of this, but what I was really passionate about once starting here at Cornell was, well, what about the LVT education? So, we've always had a longstanding LVT preceptorship program, but it kind of got reestablished and revamped in 2010.

Host: And what does that mean for everyone listening? Sorry. The preceptorship, will you just explain to our listeners?

Mikaela Frost, LVT: So, it's typically a requirement of veterinary technician schools. So, it's basically about a six-week experience and you can go anywhere. It doesn't have to be Cornell, a teaching hospital, if a general practice will take you for six weeks to get some observation and some hopefully a little bit of hands-on skills, that kind of fulfills the requirement for schools.

So, Cornell started it basically to fulfill that requirement for students, but also as a little bit of a pipeline for ourselves as well. So, it's getting the students in the door. And that's probably honestly their first experience in a specialized teaching hospital.

I believe I became co-chair of the program around 2021, but that's a little foggy of exactly what year I started it. But I did start participating in the program ever since 2017, because I was actually a preceptor at Cornell myself when I was going through tech school. So, kind of like came full circle.

Host: I love that, full circle.

Mikaela Frost, LVT: Yeah. But to be like really specific, it's a six-week program. Like I said, it's hosted throughout the summer because it's intended to be between the students' first and second year program. Or if they're in a bachelor program, it might be between their third and fourth year. And we accept about 18 total students per year because we have two different summer sessions, and they get to select two specialty services to rotate through while they're here. So, they're spending about two and a half weeks in each of those rotations that they selected. And it's mostly observational, but we do try to get them some hands-on skill development as well when they're here. Pretty basic stuff.

Like I said, they're pretty fresh in school, so teaching them things like even client communication, basics of physical exams. And then, some venipuncture—sorry, blood draws and vaccinations, things like that. We also provide them with a couple labs and lectures throughout their time here, which are very valuable to them. And they also have what's called an experience week during their preceptorship, where they're getting a lot of those skills that are required of their schools, such as pharmacy and central sterilization.

Host: Like learning how to clean and sterilize instruments, working on drugs and what they are, administration kind of thing.

Mikaela Frost, LVT: Yup. And a lot practice with drug calculations too, while they're spending time in the pharmacy, which is super important part of our job.

Host: All capital letters—super important.

Mikaela Frost, LVT: Yeah.

Host: Absolutely.

Mikaela Frost, LVT: And then, on top of all that, we try to get them some experience in public speaking. Because at the end of the program, we ask them to present us with a brief presentation on everything, or something very specific that they learned during their time here.

Host: Awesome.

Mikaela Frost, LVT: So, it's been a long-standing program that's very successful here.

Host: And I appreciate that when she mentioned—for everybody listening—when she mentioned pipeline, that's actually great. So in this case, it would be, "Hey, we have these students and they come and spend their time at Cornell." And if they work really well with the team, or they're really motivated and they have all these skills, then it's an opportunity to think about hiring them. So, I'm really excited about that. Okay. Like, you created part of this training program I heard, or the whole thing? Did you create this whole thing?

Mikaela Frost, LVT: The internship program, so a separate program.

Host: You just created also a separate program. Again, she's not busy. She's just hanging out. Wink, wink, totally lying. And then, you created this intern program. So, oh my goodness. Can you tell us what that is and why did you do it? Tell us.

Mikaela Frost, LVT: Yeah. So, I didn't do alone.

Host: Why did you add more work?

Mikaela Frost, LVT: Yes. I definitely didn't it alone. We actually planned this for a whole year, more than a year prior to our first class. And it was kind of a group of about 12-ish LVTs that we put together, and collaborated with management, and like our HR team here to put this whole thing together.

But really, what we saw was we've had this longstanding preceptorship program that's been really successful, but what was the logical next step? Like, I kept looking at, you know, we want to build this career path for LVTs. Well, what's next? And internships are something that are very common in the DVM world, especially if they want to go into specialty medicine. You know, you go logically to an internship.

Host: So, just for everybody listening quickly, when you graduate from vet school, you take a test and you are a veterinarian. If you think you want to specialize, so you want to become a large animal surgeon or a dentist, because we have a dermatologist, you do a year of an internship first, and then you must apply to your specialty learning. So, she saw that similarity or you saw that program and kind of transitioned

Mikaela Frost, LVT: Yeah, it was like the natural next step for LVTs. You know, why can't we have an internship program as well? And it wasn't something new. There are a couple other programs throughout the country, but it's not something very common and very accessible to LVTs. So, we wanted to create our own program and hopefully encourage other schools, especially teaching hospitals that have the capacity to do this to kind of follow suit. So, that's how the internship program was created.

Host: So, they've graduated from their programs program, they've taken their tests, they're LVTs, and then they come to you. And is it a year?

Mikaela Frost, LVT: It is a one-year rotating internship program.

Host: Okay. Right. Exactly the same.

Mikaela Frost, LVT: They technically just have to be a graduated LVT who is license-eligible to start the internship program. And then, we do just ask that they take their national exam and pass pretty early on in the internship, but it's not a requirement to start it.

And like the internship can look pretty different depending on their aspirations in their career. So, we have a small animal-focused rotating internship, large animal. And then, new this year, we're offering a wildlife one as well. So, we did have our first class graduate in 2025. And our second class is currently going through the internship and we typically have four to five interns per year.

Host: This is so cool. I want to make sure everybody understands just how important this is. When we graduate, two-year program, four-year program, we're all learning a lot. You are learning a lot, and some of you may have some experience, some may have more experience. It just depends on where you come from, what opportunities you had.

So, you may say, "Well, I'm a licensed veterinary technician. But, oh wow, I love wildlife. I would love to help with birds." And so, you have this opportunity for them to learn all of the things that they need to work with birds, whether it be at Cornell or at another facility. Maybe it's a sanctuary, maybe it's—so this is such a neat opportunity. I love that because, again, we're making veterinary medicine a better place for our patients no matter who they are, and that makes me happy. So, with your second kind of class coming out this year, do you have any idea of outcomes? Like, how did this first class do?

Mikaela Frost, LVT: Yeah. I don't think we could have asked for a better inaugural class for this internship. We had five interns and we hired all five into the hospital, which was like best case scenario for us. They were very successful and continued to be very successful. They're still here. So, we know the pipeline concept is working, so that's great.

Another really rewarding outcome that we saw is the impact it had on our existing LVT staff. So, they've historically been a part of teaching. Because like I said, most of them are involved in the fourth-year DVM rotation. But there's something really special about them being involved in the mentorship and teaching of future LVTs that, you know, they might be working with or sending off into the world. So, it's really been valuable for our current staffs' professional development. And honestly, it's just kind of elevated everybody who's interacting and working with these interns in the hospital.

Host: Oh, I love that. I talk a lot about wellbeing in veterinary medicine And we know that sometimes it's not easy. We have a tough job, all of us. We're doing so many things. We have our own lives. We're still humans. Things again are happening. And it can be really tough. And so, that teaching can really fill up what I like to refer to as your Soul Cup. And so, that really makes me happy to hear that you mention that because I think that's an important thing. Your skilled technicians have so much to teach others, again, including people like me who are veterinarians. So, I appreciate you so much. But I could see where they might be like, "Look at that technician now who is on her second year, his or her second year, and I helped them," and that makes me so happy. What a lovely moment.

And so, you do all these things. You're clearly trying to create this beautiful path for veterinary technicians to specialize and learn more again and benefit their patients. So if someone's listening right now and they're like, "I didn't know about this. Like, this sounds really interesting. I could consider that," what would you say to them? Do you have any advice? Are you like, "Don't do this. Get good boots," or "Know that you will be urinated on at some point in your career"—that will happen actually. What advice would you offer them?

Mikaela Frost, LVT: Yeah. I mean, outside of the obvious, which I think, you know, there's always countless tips and tricks depending on where you are, but I would just say in general, to do it. If you love animals and you're drawn to medicine, this career can be so fulfilling. And I think sometimes people overlook the LVT career path because like I said, originally when I was looking into veterinary medicine, I thought in order to be involved at a higher level of veterinary medicine, you had to be the veterinarian. And that's just not true.

And what I think people don't fully appreciate until they are in it as an LVT is how much depth and breadth you have in this career. So, your ceiling can really be wherever and whatever you want it to be, whether that's you want to be super hands-on, in the dirt of it for your whole career, getting peed and pooped on and bled on, all those things.

Host: Again, it will happen.

Mikaela Frost, LVT: You can move into leadership. You can specialize. You can get more involved in teaching and education. So like I said, the ceiling is really what you make of it. And if you have a passion for animals and for people, because let's be honest, even though we all say we do it for the love of the animals, you also have to love the people as well, then this is something—

Host: Oh, you can't do anything for the animals without talking to the people. So, she is 1000% correct.

Mikaela Frost, LVT: Yeah, So, you know, if you have all those things and that's what you're passionate about, you can make a real difference every day. And this career is definitely going to challenge you, but it can also be really fulfilling and rewarding at the same time.

Host: I love that. And man, I'm sure it's just so challenging. Oh my gosh. I've seen some of the things you all do and that's incredible. I know earlier in this interview we mentioned some of the misconceptions of the LVT, especially like you were saying, you know, "I just did the bandage change as I bring this horse out to the owner." What do you want animal owners to know about the LVT?

Mikaela Frost, LVT: Honestly, this might sound a little repetitive, but what we mentioned earlier that we are licensed medical professionals, because I don't think a lot of owners do understand that and know that. And the ones that do, that's great. But that we have gone through a rigorous education. We have passed our national boards, and that we are trained to handle some pretty complex medical situations, you know, that they immediately want to talk to the doctor about, or what's the doctor going to do, things like that. But we are very immersed in the care of their animal while they are here. And we just want the owner to feel informed and supported through the process while they're in the hospital as well. But, honestly, acknowledge the work that the LVTs are putting in.

Host: Yes. Oh, 1000%. In some instances, I think owners sometimes, because they'll talk to the doctor intermittently. And they may not even interact with the LVT a ton and just don't understand how much that technician is doing behind the scenes. So, respect your LVTs is what I have to say. I'm going to get Queens on all my listeners. And so, I really appreciate that.

And just like we talk about pivoting and veterinary medicine, she just mentioned that, as a licensed veterinary technician, you could do so many things. Education, you're like, "I just want to do surgery," great. "I just want to do emergency, great." You have these options. "I want to go teach. I only want to teach." So, it's limitless and she was right. There's no ceiling here. And I really love to hear that.

And so, before I let you go, because we talked about all these serious things, I would love to hear, if you don't mind, I would love to hear a little bit more just about you in general. Any pets at home?

Mikaela Frost, LVT: Yeah, I actually have a—he's the love of my life, honestly—an English mastiff named Hobbs.

Host: His name is Hobbs?

Mikaela Frost, LVT: He is my first child. I'm actually 25 weeks pregnant with a human child.

Host: Congratulations!

Mikaela Frost, LVT: But I always reassure him all the time that you are my first baby.

Host: Oh my God. Sorry, everybody. I'm clapping. Yes. That's amazing!

Mikaela Frost, LVT: But yeah, I do only have the one dog at home. But, you know, he is like my child and my family.

Host: And he's a mastiff. So, that's a lot of dog.

Mikaela Frost, LVT: Yeah. I've honestly steered clear of the large animal ownership for now because I kind of fill that cup at work, and also kind of taking care of other people's animals. So, it's something I know I love them, but I don't want to deal with the vet bills at home.

Host: Rational. That is—hey guys. Listen, having animals can be pricey, especially when these animals are so ill, right? A thousand-pound animal definitely takes a lot of supplies, takes a lot of things to take care of them. So, absolutely. Okay. That's a whole lot of dog, right? And now, yes, she's got a few things coming along in life, so maybe no additional pets right now.

Any hobbies—do you have time for hobbies? Let's tell everybody. Like, you have a baby coming and you're working and you have this dog. Do you get to do hobbies? Are you human?

Mikaela Frost, LVT: I am a little human, but I do feel like a lot of us in the veterinary career are very much workaholics. And I try not to be as much, but I'm just very passionate about my work and all these extra programs and it does take up a lot of time in my life. And that's okay right now, at least. It's something I enjoy. But I do have some hobbies I like to enjoy, which are pretty basic hobbies. But I do like exercising specifically. I got really into rucking with a coworker here.

Host: Cool.

Mikaela Frost, LVT: I've kind of fallen off the wagon in my third trimester here.

Host: I mean, she's carrying—she's essentially rucking all the time. She doesn't know, right? Because rucking is like walking or doing these like long hikes with a pack, like a weighted—just weight.

Mikaela Frost, LVT: Yep. So, hiking in general, my husband and I have always really enjoyed. You know, if we're going to go on a vacation, which is often a staycation and doing work at home, we at least like to fit in a few hikes or go up to the Adirondacks, and hike the high peaks and stuff there. So, definitely into hiking, reading when I can, but yeah.

Host: Mikaela, thank you so much for joining us. I really, really appreciate it. After I drop the bomb of salty snack, I tell her I like sugar and then I'm closing the conversation.

But a reminder for everyone, veterinary technicians, like the profession just could not survive without our veterinary technicians. They're behind the scenes. They're in front of the scenes. They're with large animal, they're with exotics, they're with small animal, they're in research. They, again, are the legs we stand on.

Veterinary Technician Week is in October. Feel free to look that up so you could celebrate with your favorite technician. But you can tell them a thank you or send them a note any time of year because we could not do what we do without the veterinary technician. So just as a veterinarian, again, who has worked with the most fabulous technicians that, again, I feel so lucky to have worked with, I really sincerely thank you and thank you for sharing your journey and what you do every day with our listeners. And yeah, just thank you.

Mikaela Frost, LVT: Yeah. Thank you so much for having me.

Host: Yeah, anytime. And I hope everyone enjoyed this episode of the Cornell Veterinary Podcast. Look into licensed veterinary technician programs. Maybe you're interested, maybe this spoke to you. And I'll come back with another episode soon. Like, listen, subscribe on your favorite platform, And we will talk to you soon. Don't forget the Olympics. Bye.