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Mask Science: What are the Proven Facts of Face Coverings
Dr. Jason Chertoff discusses the importance of wearing masks to protect you and your family from COVID-19.
Featuring:
Learn more about Jason Chertoff, MD, MPH
Jason Chertoff, MD, MPH
Jason Chertoff, MD, MPH specializes in Pulmonary & Critical Care Medicine.Learn more about Jason Chertoff, MD, MPH
Transcription:
Scott Webb: Though there was some doubt in the beginning about the effectiveness of face coverings in slowing the spread of COVID-19, there's complete agreement by healthcare professionals today that they slow the spread of the virus and save lives. And here today to drive this point home is Dr. Jason Chertoff. He's board certified in internal medicine and specializes in pulmonary and critical care medicine at Genesis.
This is Sounds of Good Health with Genesis brought to you by Genesis Healthcare System. I'm Scott Webb. So Dr. Chertoff, thanks so much for joining me. Tell us briefly about your role at Genesis and what you've learned about wearing masks during COVID-19.
Dr. Jason Chertoff: I am an intensive care doctor and a pulmonologist. I would say three-quarters of the time I'm in the intensive care unit and my other time spent in pulmonary clinic, seeing patients in the clinic one day a week. As far as masks go in the ICU, I've definitely seen my share of patients with COVID coming in. Typically, they do state that they were not wearing masks or were around people that were not wearing masks. And we did not have a lot of cases when the state mandated mask- wearing. That was lifted in and we're starting to see an extreme rise in cases. I'm sure other things are factors, but I definitely think that, uh, mask-wearing and not mask-wearing is one of the main factors that we can say has caused some of the rise in the cases that we're seeing.
Scott Webb: You know, there's a lot of discussion about whether they really work or not. You and I both know that they do, but we're here to try to convince everyone else. So as a doctor caring for COVID-19 patients, what have you learned about the importance of wearing masks during this period?
Dr. Jason Chertoff: Before all this started, I thought it was, you know, common knowledge that masks prevent droplets from, you know, getting from one person to another. And COVID happens to be a respiratory illness. It's spread by droplets, respiratory droplets. And one of the main ways we have at preventing that, uh, is from everybody or as many people as possible wearing masks.
It's very simple. If the person who has COVID is wearing a mask and then also the recipient or the people surrounding him are wearing masks, the likelihood that the virus and those droplets can get from one person to another is extremely low. Wearing a mask that covers your nose and your mouth will always be more effective than not wearing a mask at all. Not a hundred percent effective, but certainly much more effective than not wearing a mask.
Like I said, in my anecdotal experience, the patients who do come into the hospital maybe were not as vigilant about mask-wearing as a lot of the people that I surround myself with in the healthcare field are very cautious about wearing masks at all times and staying at least six feet away from other people.
Scott Webb: Yeah. So let's talk about you and your colleagues, doctors and nurses. You've all been wearing masks for years, though presumably more now than ever or for longer periods than ever. Can you share with us some of the science behind masks and, you know, we see people in the grocery store and other places wearing them, but they're often sagging or drooping below their noses? So let's talk about the science and let's talk about what happens when people don't wear them properly.
Dr. Jason Chertoff: Yes. I've been a physician for quite some time and even before COVID came. I was wearing masks when I had a common cold, when I had the flu, when I had anything where I thought I could cause my patients to get sick. I would wear a mask because just like any other virus, COVID and anything that's transmitted through respiratory droplets, you wear a mask, you're preventing the droplets from getting to another person. And in addition to that, you're also protecting yourself. I don't know what Illnesses and viruses and other types of infectious diseases my patients have. Especially nowadays, I assume everybody has COVID until proven otherwise and I take the necessary precautions.
There's been plenty of science mostly surrounding the flu pandemics over the course of history, really just looking at, uh, kind of the viral inoculum or the amount of viral particles that get from one person to another using the mask. And over and over again, it's shown that the amount of particles getting from one person to another is reduced by mask-wearing, especially if both are wearing masks, both parties are wearing masks and that's with other viruses as well. And there's very little reason to believe that the coronavirus COVID-19 behaves any differently than, you know, other respiratory viruses that we've dealt with in the past.
Scott Webb: You know, one of the issues that I have with my mask is that it fogs up my glasses. And I've also heard a lot of people complain about the masks are hot, not being able to talk, people can't understand them. So you, as a doctor who is accustomed to wearing a mask for long periods and communicating with people, can you give us some tips about how to comfortably wear a mask and communicate, you know, clearly and effectively?
Dr. Jason Chertoff: I've come across those barriers as well, for sure. I wear glasses most of the day. I never wear contact lenses and some fog and some don't. But I've found the ones that you can kind of fit to your nose and has that piece where you can kind of bend it to your nose works better than the ones that don't have that I've found.
The way I look at it is would I rather have a little bit of an inconvenience in the day or get sick or get somebody else sick. I mean really, in the end of the day, I would just prefer to be a little bit inconvenienced. It's not the most comfortable thing in the world, but I feel like it's important. We don't have any other treatments really. Right now, we have a few, but nothing that's the silver bullet that's gonna make everything go away drastically. So I think this is one thing we definitely can do that has been shown to protect the community and protect ourselves.
Scott Webb: You know, there's such a range of masks and face coverings and protective efforts out there from just somebody wrapping a bandana around their face, and I've seen people at the stores that have on, they look like spacesuits practically, and everything in between, the neck gaiter and surgical type masks. So you, as an expert and someone who's used to wearing masks especially, which ones do you recommend and why?
Dr. Jason Chertoff: Obviously, the most important thing is no matter what you use, you're using something to cover your nose and mouth. But, if N95s were available to everyone, I certainly think that that would be helpful, but as far as resources go, that's not really feasible at this time. So, think just a regular old surgical mask is what I would recommend. Cloth, paper, it doesn't really matter. Something that has a good barrier between your nose, mouth and other people.
Scott Webb: Yeah, that's the key takeaway here is please just wear it, wear it properly, practice good mask hygiene. That's another thing, you know. You see people at the stores and they're wearing masks, but you see them shifting their mask around. And I don't think that they quite understand that mask hygiene is also important, right?
Dr. Jason Chertoff: Minimizing the amount of time you take your mask off your face. it does not take long for the droplets to get into the air. So I mean, minimizing the amount of time you're taking it off your nose, off your mouth, touching everything, you touching your nose, your mouth, and then whatever you touch after that. Minimizing those maneuvers that we do, and we're not even aware of it is very important.
I know it's easier said than done. Going back to what I was saying before, it's not the most comfortable thing to wear a mask. We're not used to that, but I have twin four-year old’s, they can do it. They have very little problems doing it. They get uncomfortable with a lot of things. I have not heard them once complained about being uncomfortable with a mask. So I feel like if they can do it, we can as well.
Scott Webb: It's like every day is Halloween when you're a kid and you get to wear a mask, right?
Dr. Jason Chertoff: Yeah, and you can make it fun for them. My kids are so accustomed to wearing masks now that my daughter actually sometimes wants to just wear it, even when we're not out, when we're in the house. She just likes to wear a mask and that's fine. I think it's a good habit to get into.
Scott Webb: We're all doing our best, but we're all weary from COVID. We're tired of the mask. We're tired of COVID, tired of talking about it. What would you like to share with us who feel that way about the virus, about masks? How can we be a little less weary? How can we stay vigilant? How can we stay positive, especially when it comes to masks?
Dr. Jason Chertoff: I try to think about that it's not even about me. I hope other people think the same way. It's really not about me. It's more as a community as a whole. This is your part. We're doing our part to keep everybody safe. And if it was just about me, I think I might fall into that, "Oh, I'm just, you know, not in the mood to wear a mask anymore." But when I start thinking about how other people can be affected, I get motivated. I get motivated to do the right thing, to do my part and keeping everybody else healthy, myself healthy, my family healthy, people I'm around.
There is talk about vaccines in the future and, yeah, I'm starting to see a light at the end of the tunnel. But if you're following the news, cases are at an all-time high now, deaths are at an all-time high now. Just my anecdotal experience, I'm seeing more cases now in the ICU in the last two weeks than I have in the entire COVID pandemic. Very severe cases, ventilators, lots and lots of deaths, unfortunately.
When I think about, “OH, I'm tired" and that sort of thing. Yes, nobody wants to be doing this and it's a hardship for most people, but the alternative is much worse. So that's kind of my mindset.
Scott Webb: When we talk about recommendations and where we'd like to direct people to check the science for themselves, to check the facts for themselves, what would you recommend in terms of reliable information?
Dr. Jason Chertoff: The CDC website has numerous references to articles citing the science behind a mask-wearing. The CDC is definitely the first place I would go to for that sort of information.
Scott Webb: What else would you like to add today to explain to listeners what's going on, how they can protect themselves and how to stay vigilant in all of our efforts for everybody to stay well until the vaccine gets to everybody, until this thing is really beaten?
Dr. Jason Chertoff: I respect people's freedoms and people's choices and independence. I would just emphasize now that that this is more than affecting just you alone, the mask wearer. There's many, many, many people whose lives have been affected negatively by this. And so making the choice of whether or not to wear a mask doesn't just affect you alone, it affects the numerous people you encounter on a daily basis. So I think that would be the number one. Sometimes it's hard to get into that mindset, but in this case very true that the mask is not just for me, it's for society as a whole.
Scott Webb: Yeah. I think that's a great way to end and you put it so perfectly there that, you know, the masks protect all of us. We're in this together and we're only going to beat COVID-19 if we all work together. It starts of course with all of the healthcare heroes, doctors and nurses and everybody else all the way down to cute four-year-old twins wearing their masks even when they don't have to. We all have to do our part. And I definitely appreciate everything you're doing and everything that Genesis is doing. And doctor, you stay well.
You too. Thank you very much.
To learn more about how Genesis is caring for our community throughout COVID-19, go to GenesisHCS.org. And thanks for listening to Sounds of Good Health with Genesis brought to you by Genesis Healthcare System. If you found this podcast helpful, please share it on your social channels and check out the full podcast library for additional topics of interest. I'm Scott Webb. Stay well.
Scott Webb: Though there was some doubt in the beginning about the effectiveness of face coverings in slowing the spread of COVID-19, there's complete agreement by healthcare professionals today that they slow the spread of the virus and save lives. And here today to drive this point home is Dr. Jason Chertoff. He's board certified in internal medicine and specializes in pulmonary and critical care medicine at Genesis.
This is Sounds of Good Health with Genesis brought to you by Genesis Healthcare System. I'm Scott Webb. So Dr. Chertoff, thanks so much for joining me. Tell us briefly about your role at Genesis and what you've learned about wearing masks during COVID-19.
Dr. Jason Chertoff: I am an intensive care doctor and a pulmonologist. I would say three-quarters of the time I'm in the intensive care unit and my other time spent in pulmonary clinic, seeing patients in the clinic one day a week. As far as masks go in the ICU, I've definitely seen my share of patients with COVID coming in. Typically, they do state that they were not wearing masks or were around people that were not wearing masks. And we did not have a lot of cases when the state mandated mask- wearing. That was lifted in and we're starting to see an extreme rise in cases. I'm sure other things are factors, but I definitely think that, uh, mask-wearing and not mask-wearing is one of the main factors that we can say has caused some of the rise in the cases that we're seeing.
Scott Webb: You know, there's a lot of discussion about whether they really work or not. You and I both know that they do, but we're here to try to convince everyone else. So as a doctor caring for COVID-19 patients, what have you learned about the importance of wearing masks during this period?
Dr. Jason Chertoff: Before all this started, I thought it was, you know, common knowledge that masks prevent droplets from, you know, getting from one person to another. And COVID happens to be a respiratory illness. It's spread by droplets, respiratory droplets. And one of the main ways we have at preventing that, uh, is from everybody or as many people as possible wearing masks.
It's very simple. If the person who has COVID is wearing a mask and then also the recipient or the people surrounding him are wearing masks, the likelihood that the virus and those droplets can get from one person to another is extremely low. Wearing a mask that covers your nose and your mouth will always be more effective than not wearing a mask at all. Not a hundred percent effective, but certainly much more effective than not wearing a mask.
Like I said, in my anecdotal experience, the patients who do come into the hospital maybe were not as vigilant about mask-wearing as a lot of the people that I surround myself with in the healthcare field are very cautious about wearing masks at all times and staying at least six feet away from other people.
Scott Webb: Yeah. So let's talk about you and your colleagues, doctors and nurses. You've all been wearing masks for years, though presumably more now than ever or for longer periods than ever. Can you share with us some of the science behind masks and, you know, we see people in the grocery store and other places wearing them, but they're often sagging or drooping below their noses? So let's talk about the science and let's talk about what happens when people don't wear them properly.
Dr. Jason Chertoff: Yes. I've been a physician for quite some time and even before COVID came. I was wearing masks when I had a common cold, when I had the flu, when I had anything where I thought I could cause my patients to get sick. I would wear a mask because just like any other virus, COVID and anything that's transmitted through respiratory droplets, you wear a mask, you're preventing the droplets from getting to another person. And in addition to that, you're also protecting yourself. I don't know what Illnesses and viruses and other types of infectious diseases my patients have. Especially nowadays, I assume everybody has COVID until proven otherwise and I take the necessary precautions.
There's been plenty of science mostly surrounding the flu pandemics over the course of history, really just looking at, uh, kind of the viral inoculum or the amount of viral particles that get from one person to another using the mask. And over and over again, it's shown that the amount of particles getting from one person to another is reduced by mask-wearing, especially if both are wearing masks, both parties are wearing masks and that's with other viruses as well. And there's very little reason to believe that the coronavirus COVID-19 behaves any differently than, you know, other respiratory viruses that we've dealt with in the past.
Scott Webb: You know, one of the issues that I have with my mask is that it fogs up my glasses. And I've also heard a lot of people complain about the masks are hot, not being able to talk, people can't understand them. So you, as a doctor who is accustomed to wearing a mask for long periods and communicating with people, can you give us some tips about how to comfortably wear a mask and communicate, you know, clearly and effectively?
Dr. Jason Chertoff: I've come across those barriers as well, for sure. I wear glasses most of the day. I never wear contact lenses and some fog and some don't. But I've found the ones that you can kind of fit to your nose and has that piece where you can kind of bend it to your nose works better than the ones that don't have that I've found.
The way I look at it is would I rather have a little bit of an inconvenience in the day or get sick or get somebody else sick. I mean really, in the end of the day, I would just prefer to be a little bit inconvenienced. It's not the most comfortable thing in the world, but I feel like it's important. We don't have any other treatments really. Right now, we have a few, but nothing that's the silver bullet that's gonna make everything go away drastically. So I think this is one thing we definitely can do that has been shown to protect the community and protect ourselves.
Scott Webb: You know, there's such a range of masks and face coverings and protective efforts out there from just somebody wrapping a bandana around their face, and I've seen people at the stores that have on, they look like spacesuits practically, and everything in between, the neck gaiter and surgical type masks. So you, as an expert and someone who's used to wearing masks especially, which ones do you recommend and why?
Dr. Jason Chertoff: Obviously, the most important thing is no matter what you use, you're using something to cover your nose and mouth. But, if N95s were available to everyone, I certainly think that that would be helpful, but as far as resources go, that's not really feasible at this time. So, think just a regular old surgical mask is what I would recommend. Cloth, paper, it doesn't really matter. Something that has a good barrier between your nose, mouth and other people.
Scott Webb: Yeah, that's the key takeaway here is please just wear it, wear it properly, practice good mask hygiene. That's another thing, you know. You see people at the stores and they're wearing masks, but you see them shifting their mask around. And I don't think that they quite understand that mask hygiene is also important, right?
Dr. Jason Chertoff: Minimizing the amount of time you take your mask off your face. it does not take long for the droplets to get into the air. So I mean, minimizing the amount of time you're taking it off your nose, off your mouth, touching everything, you touching your nose, your mouth, and then whatever you touch after that. Minimizing those maneuvers that we do, and we're not even aware of it is very important.
I know it's easier said than done. Going back to what I was saying before, it's not the most comfortable thing to wear a mask. We're not used to that, but I have twin four-year old’s, they can do it. They have very little problems doing it. They get uncomfortable with a lot of things. I have not heard them once complained about being uncomfortable with a mask. So I feel like if they can do it, we can as well.
Scott Webb: It's like every day is Halloween when you're a kid and you get to wear a mask, right?
Dr. Jason Chertoff: Yeah, and you can make it fun for them. My kids are so accustomed to wearing masks now that my daughter actually sometimes wants to just wear it, even when we're not out, when we're in the house. She just likes to wear a mask and that's fine. I think it's a good habit to get into.
Scott Webb: We're all doing our best, but we're all weary from COVID. We're tired of the mask. We're tired of COVID, tired of talking about it. What would you like to share with us who feel that way about the virus, about masks? How can we be a little less weary? How can we stay vigilant? How can we stay positive, especially when it comes to masks?
Dr. Jason Chertoff: I try to think about that it's not even about me. I hope other people think the same way. It's really not about me. It's more as a community as a whole. This is your part. We're doing our part to keep everybody safe. And if it was just about me, I think I might fall into that, "Oh, I'm just, you know, not in the mood to wear a mask anymore." But when I start thinking about how other people can be affected, I get motivated. I get motivated to do the right thing, to do my part and keeping everybody else healthy, myself healthy, my family healthy, people I'm around.
There is talk about vaccines in the future and, yeah, I'm starting to see a light at the end of the tunnel. But if you're following the news, cases are at an all-time high now, deaths are at an all-time high now. Just my anecdotal experience, I'm seeing more cases now in the ICU in the last two weeks than I have in the entire COVID pandemic. Very severe cases, ventilators, lots and lots of deaths, unfortunately.
When I think about, “OH, I'm tired" and that sort of thing. Yes, nobody wants to be doing this and it's a hardship for most people, but the alternative is much worse. So that's kind of my mindset.
Scott Webb: When we talk about recommendations and where we'd like to direct people to check the science for themselves, to check the facts for themselves, what would you recommend in terms of reliable information?
Dr. Jason Chertoff: The CDC website has numerous references to articles citing the science behind a mask-wearing. The CDC is definitely the first place I would go to for that sort of information.
Scott Webb: What else would you like to add today to explain to listeners what's going on, how they can protect themselves and how to stay vigilant in all of our efforts for everybody to stay well until the vaccine gets to everybody, until this thing is really beaten?
Dr. Jason Chertoff: I respect people's freedoms and people's choices and independence. I would just emphasize now that that this is more than affecting just you alone, the mask wearer. There's many, many, many people whose lives have been affected negatively by this. And so making the choice of whether or not to wear a mask doesn't just affect you alone, it affects the numerous people you encounter on a daily basis. So I think that would be the number one. Sometimes it's hard to get into that mindset, but in this case very true that the mask is not just for me, it's for society as a whole.
Scott Webb: Yeah. I think that's a great way to end and you put it so perfectly there that, you know, the masks protect all of us. We're in this together and we're only going to beat COVID-19 if we all work together. It starts of course with all of the healthcare heroes, doctors and nurses and everybody else all the way down to cute four-year-old twins wearing their masks even when they don't have to. We all have to do our part. And I definitely appreciate everything you're doing and everything that Genesis is doing. And doctor, you stay well.
You too. Thank you very much.
To learn more about how Genesis is caring for our community throughout COVID-19, go to GenesisHCS.org. And thanks for listening to Sounds of Good Health with Genesis brought to you by Genesis Healthcare System. If you found this podcast helpful, please share it on your social channels and check out the full podcast library for additional topics of interest. I'm Scott Webb. Stay well.