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Kathleen Colella, AuD, CCC-A (Host): You're listening to Amplified, presented by Lurie Children's. Transcripts of this and all episodes can be found at luriechildrens.org/amplified. During our last episode, our heroine, Katie Radasevich received hearing aids at the age of two and a half years old. It might seem that hearing aids would be the end of this story, but truthfully they're often just the beginning for a family with a child with a hearing loss.

And a large part of that is going to school. Most students in the United States spend almost 9,000 hours of their life between elementary and middle school alone. That's a lot of time for listening and learning to go on to high school and beyond. When Katie received her hearing loss diagnosis and hearing aids, Rudy and Eileen decided that they wanted Katie to use their home language, spoken English in order to communicate.

So at age three, she went off to preschool. You have a toddler at home who has these new hearing aids, and then she goes to preschool. You got her in preschool right away,

Eileen Radasevich: Right away. They have, the, our school district had, we had to wait until she was three, her birthday's September 10th. So as soon as she, she was three, we had it all set up and she attended the Speech and Hearing Preschool. And two teachers, 10 children. It was the most amazing, just to see the progress that that happened from September 10th to the end of that first year was just it was amazing.

Rudy Radasevich: But even her classmates, they were mostly boys and speech delayed. So there was another, not another hearing impaired kid, I don't think in your early years of Speech Language, Preschool. And I remember Ms. Marva would come with the bus and stop a little, the little bus and stop at the end of the driveway. And Katie would climb on the bus cause she wasn't big enough to walk up the stairs with her little knapsack on and wave to us. And she was off with Ms. Marva all day with these teachers. And I think they did some wonderful things with the speech therapy aspect of it.

So that Katie's speech patterns developed, which sounded like speech patterns out of the majority of kids, as opposed to speech patterns coming out of someone with a profound hearing loss who hasn't heard things correctly. Katie had none of that. And I attribute a lot of that to the speech and language, preschool speech, and hearing preschool. She went to as a, as a toddler.

Kathleen Colella, AuD, CCC-A (Host): Was it hard to see her get on a bus at such a young age? I can't imagine.

Eileen Radasevich: I was, I wanted to get in the car and follow it,

Rudy Radasevich: but instead she would scream make good choices at three.

Eileen Radasevich: But. But they just took such good care of, of you and your three-year-old classmates. It was fabulous. And these two teachers just said, give her to us. We just, this is what we are here for. This is, this is, you know, just so wonderful that we can start from that, at that time, three was the, was the youngest they would take, um, kids, but maybe they're doing it even younger now. Which would be wonderful.

Katie Radasevich: Yeah. I think you guys touch on a lot about, um, you know, just early intervention, starting with that newborn hearing screening and being able to catch these kids earlier, because then of course we can start speech therapy day one when those hearing aids are put on too, that can also happen at six weeks, you know, two months, which is so cool. Because I think that my journey was kind of an anomaly compared to what we really hope to be able to do for these kids now. Um, that a kid who was diagnosed with moderately severe hearing loss like myself, you know, we can intervene so much faster too. And just provide those services in the home. And so by the time they're three, they would have already gone through potentially a couple of years of therapy. So maybe they can start in a preschool program, more caught up to their peers.

Kathleen Colella, AuD, CCC-A (Host): Yeah. Now a child with a diagnosis at age two and a half is concerning because the standards have improved. And I think it is amazing of the strides Katie made in such a short period of time. Um, you know, we don't know. I know you don't know what caused her hearing loss. Uh, she was exposed to aminoglycosides as a newborn. Um, but we don't know, you know, was it there all along? Did it progress and we'll never know, but you did the right thing when you found out because a lot of times it doesn't matter what caused it. What you do about it?

Rudy Radasevich: Right?

Kathleen Colella, AuD, CCC-A (Host): Aminoglycosides are a type of antibiotic commonly administered in suspected or confirmed cases of sepsis or meningitis in newborns and infants. Katie also received aminoglycosides as a newborn. Aminoglycosides are necessary and effective, but are now known to sometimes cause hearing loss. Risk of developing a hearing loss has been linked to several factors at birth, including low birth weight, prematurity and fetal infections like cytomegalovirus or CMV to just name a few.

There are actually so many risk factors for hearing loss in infancy, the topic has a governing body called the Joint Committee on Infant Hearing. This group regularly reviews the science surrounding best practice for early detection and intervention of hearing loss and guidelines for high risk, monitoring.

Katie Radasevich: I also think it's so, you know, looking at pictures of myself, wearing hearing aids at four and five, these hearing aids are like as big as my head. Right. And they're beige and they're not terribly attractive. Right. And so I do think we've come such a long way in terms of technology too. Um, that hearing aids are now Bluetooth compatible. Parents can have apps on their phone with a Find My Hearing Aid Tracker, you know, we can pick out pretty much any color under the sun for hearing aids and ear molds.

And just if that's what a parent chooses to do, I think there's so much more availability for parent involvement, um, rather than 30 years ago, just kind of showing up to an appointment. Okay. These are the hearing aids. There's not a lot of discussion of these are the different brands we work with. And so I do think that also allows parents to have more ownership too, especially with a young child, because it is going to take some time for that child to be able to put those hearing aids in themselves, um, and really kind of take off.

And I do think also you can potentially struggle with a kiddo who's just not interested in wearing their hearing aids and that can be. A big challenge. And I think that can make families feel really isolated too that we're trying to do everything we can, but when you have a fierce one-year-old, two-year-old who can just pull these hearing aids out, I think being able to at least pick a color they like, or, you know, just trying to make some part of it, just more exciting for them. It's been so cool to see that, you know, that progression as well.

Kathleen Colella, AuD, CCC-A (Host): Yeah. There's a, there's a true pediatric culture around hearing loss. It was, I think for a long time, it was just about adults with hearing loss and oh yes, and then there are some kids that we're going to treat like small adults, but that's not the case. Really. They need their own culture and lifestyle and community because it's not just this individual who needs the help. It's also their family and caregivers and school is so much part of it.

Let's talk about what it was like to have a child in special education, to have that label, because I think it's a label that a lot of families struggle with.

Eileen Radasevich: I was thrilled and it didn't, even to me, that was that to me, it was fabulous that this, this preschool existed. And, uh, from that point on, Katie continued on with her peers into elementary school and, and had services, but she was, um, there was no such, to me, there was no such a negative connotation to her having the services and that, but the preschool was considered special ed, but I was thrilled that it existed. And it's interesting you say that because, uh, down the line, her sister was in second grade and still wasn't reading and her, I had just been working so hard with her and her, um, teacher called me one day and she was, and I knew her teacher well, and she was so apprehensive in how she was approaching this conversation that she was eventually leading to, that there was a special program for Julie to be a part of that she, they could help her with her reading.

And I said to her teacher, I said, are you worried that I'm going to think that this somehow labels Julie. And she said, well, you would be surprised at how parents are upset. And I said, oh my gosh, I'm thrilled that there is a, she won't work with me, but maybe she'll really be helped by this. And it was sure enough within weeks it was like somebody had switched out on light bulb and she was reading away. And now she teaches English and, and reads, you know, four books at a time.

Rudy Radasevich: But at the same, at the same time, the connotation of your kid's in special ed, they take the short bus. I mean, all of that stigmatic stuff is there. Um, and we didn't, we were so delighted that the services were there, that we were overjoyed about it. But the, and again, this is 25 years ago, the stigma of special ed, my kid isn't special. As opposed to now, my daughter has a 504 or my daughter has an IEP. We can talk about what those are, um, which are special ed programs, but sure that that stigma was there. It wasn't really discussed because no one would talk about that way with us, but you know, just think about growing up, you know, he takes the short bus, she's she's in special ed.

There must be something wrong. No, there's not something wrong. They need additional services. They need an individualized educational program for them. And this is how we get there. But yeah, watching others. And the conversation we had with, with our middle daughter's second grade teacher is a perfect example of people are, are feel that I know that can't be my kid.

There can't be anything wrong with my kid might get in a special ed. Well,maybe the, your kid does need a little assistance and to get this assistance, this is how the state sets up these programs so that you can get it.

Kathleen Colella, AuD, CCC-A (Host): Did Katie have a IEP or 504?

Rudy Radasevich: She had an IEP.

Kathleen Colella, AuD, CCC-A (Host): Okay. And then moving through all through elementary school IEP.

Rudy Radasevich: And then we moved her into a high school and she went to Bennett, which is a Catholic high school, of course, she's not going to get an IEP there. And by the time she got into Bennett, I then bought an F, she had an FM system, um, got some antiquated technology versus what kids have today, but we bought an FM system that she brought to school at Bennett and used for about a week. But even those adaptive services, because the type of adaptive services that a hearing impaired kid needs from the school's perspective are, are not difficult. You know, not really, they, need speech therapy. So you get a speech therapist there, a hearing itinerant teacher to kind of track them along, some preferential seating in the classroom and maybe an FM system. And, uh, Katie had a wonderful experience with one of her teachers early on, who was wearing the FM system. Katie you want to tell that story or?

Katie Radasevich: Sure. So I was in second grade, um, and to kind of, um, start off before we talk about that, there was actually one other little girl in our neighborhood who, uh, also had a hearing loss. And so while we didn't know a ton of kids who had hearing loss, it, we were very fortunate that there was someone down the street, um, Stephanie, who had hearing aids as well. And she and I were, our birthdays were five days apart. So it was really awesome. And of course from the school's perspective, like, okay, well, let's just put them in the same classroom, they both use the same FM system. You need the, you know, similar services. Um, and so we were in the second grade together and our teacher, uh, went, stepped outside and he went to use the restroom. That's when you found out how good the range was on these FM systems, even, even then, you know, and so, you know, Stephanie and I are kind of giving each other little glances across the room, like, oh, are you you hearing this? Yeah, I'm hearing it too. And um, our teacher comes back in and then very quickly he looks at me or he looks at Stephanie, you know, and just realizes what's just happened. And you know, it kind of gives us a look and, you know, we kind of just move on, but it was, um, yeah. You know, just stuff like that. And I think it was great though, that I had that classmate who I could like experience school with a hearing loss, you know, we became fast friends and we were friends for a long time. Um, and then, you know, I think you start to grow up and have different interests so by the time we got to middle school, we just had, you know, different things that we were excited about. But especially early on, that was so huge for me and huge for our family too, because I feel like Stephanie and I hung out a lot.

Um, and so that was awesome to have that friendship that then transferred into the school system too, especially with the FM system. You know, like my dad mentioned, FM systems are so much more conspicuous now, you know, and so I used to have to wear a big black loop around my neck that connected to this box that I wore on my, you know, my pants.

Um, and so it was, you know, there, there, wasn't a lot of great ways to kind of make that look very dressy, but I also was the kid who wore overalls, you know, and, and I didn't care. You know, it kind of fit my personality anyway, but it is, you know, just nice again to have that kind of, that friendship and that relationship of trust with someone else.

And it was great, you know, with listening checks and if we needed to make sure our equipment was working okay, having this other person in the classroom too, was just really just nice and kind of took the load off a little bit. Um, but yes, I will admit by the time I was 15, I was very over wearing an FM system. It's tough once you, you know, get to an early, you know, a later part of your academic career. But, you know, I also think that we've just seen how successful these kids are now with FM systems too, which is great.

Kathleen Colella, AuD, CCC-A (Host): Were there ever any challenges with Katie services? Uh, before she hit high school, you know, were, was there ever any issues of them thinking she didn't need them?

Eileen Radasevich: Oh yes. There was one year in particular. I think it was either fourth or fifth grade, still at the elementary school. And of course, Katie, even at, by then, we had always worked along with her because, um, she had advocates. And we were her advocate, but we wanted her to become her own advocate. That's the whole goal with, uh, not just her hearing loss, just in, in her, her social life or life outside the house.

And, um, and so she was very capable and the, uh, the district, uh, higher ups came and said, oh, you know, I don't think she needs this anymore. And we were in her IEP meeting at the time. And everybody else in the room, looked at this person and said, oh, absolutely not. And of course Katie's dad was very vocal about absolutely not. And, and I think that was really the only time we were, we were faced with the possibility that we, that we really had to speak up.

Kathleen Colella, AuD, CCC-A (Host): What was the rationale for thinking she didn't need it? What data did they have?

Rudy Radasevich: Not really data, him looking at Katie in the room. Watching her watching her interact, listening to her speech patterns and thought she doesn't need anything anymore. And everybody else in the room said, what is a matter with you? She's doing so well because she's getting these assisted services and she's going to keep getting them. Right. And he goes, and he basically said, um, yes, yes.

Kathleen Colella, AuD, CCC-A (Host): Right. I think that's always such a backwards logic when parents hear that because they observe them using this and think oh, they probably don't need it, but they're using it at the time of the observation.

Eileen Radasevich: Correct.

Kathleen Colella, AuD, CCC-A (Host): Well, good for you for speaking up. And it was great there was a team of people.

Rudy Radasevich: Katie's team was, was, uh, of a single mind that she's doing extremely well. And she did extremely well in a large part based on the assisted services she was getting and we're not going to take those away and just say, well, can you do it on your own? No, no, that's not a conversation.

Katie Radasevich: I do think a big part of my success early on too, was how we talked about that self-advocacy. Um, that, you know, I feel like, yes, fourth and fifth grade, I was sitting there in the IEP as well. Um, and that, um, I think was really good for me too, to be able to be involved, um, at an early age. And it wasn't, um, you know, it wasn't, oh, you, you must come to this. I wanted to do that. Um, you know, and, and be part of that as well. So that was really, I felt very included, which is, you know, I think also what kids want too, they just want to feel included whether it's with their peers or with adults, you know, so I did feel included in that respect and that was, um, I do remember that as well, just feeling very grown up and, um, you know, just being able to take ownership of what's going well and, and you know, what the next school year was gonna bring.

Rudy Radasevich: Katie, when did you start, um, in-servicing the teachers that you had from year to year, that was maybe middle school you started doing it yourself?

Katie Radasevich: Yeah I would say, I would say middle school. And then by the time I got to, um, high school, um, as my dad mentioned, there wasn't an IEP in place anymore. And so it was more just kind of like an informal session. I believe freshman year was really kind of the only year that we did that. Um, because once I stopped using the FM system, it wasn't there wasn't a lot more to talk about. Um, but I do feel like, yeah, I would say, you know, I was 12, 13, 14 starting to really kind of in-service teachers as well. And that was really great because that allowed me to get to know them and then them get to know me more on a personal level too, to be able to put it all together.

Rudy Radasevich: But I have heard some horror stories along the way. I volunteer for an organization called Equip for Equality that assists parents in navigating through the IEP process and the 504 process. And I'm an intake volunteer. And I talk to the parents about what the issues are that they're experiencing with their son or daughter.

And, um, we were fortunate because Naperville has a very supportive special education program. Um, and it's, it's a relatively affluent community, particularly if you get into communities that don't have the real estate tax base that other schools, other communities do, and don't have as much money available, the expenditure becomes a significant influence, difficult problem for the school district. And it's not that they don't want to supply the services, it's that they're trying to figure out how to do it. And it becomes a struggle between parent and organization, but they just need to stay on it.

Kathleen Colella, AuD, CCC-A (Host): Absolutely Katie, how was it transitioning from the public school system where you had support and FM system hearing itinerant to a private high school where, you know, you, you had your own FM system that you brought that we now know you didn't use, but beyond that, you know, all of a sudden you had dropped all the support you previously had. What was that like?

Katie Radasevich: Sure. So I think that, um, the transition I was very excited about because I think just because of my personality, the alternative to going to Bennett was going to the public high school where I would have graduated with a thousand other kids in my class. And that just wasn't the right fit for me at the time.

So I was really looking forward to going to a smaller school. Um, and I also think because I had been the girl with hearing aids for the last 14 years, it was nice to kind of get a fresh start. Because most of my classmates, you know, it did not go to Bennett with me. Um, and so there was just a small handful that were making the transition.

And so I think it just kind of allowed me to kind of start over and I even remembered thinking like, oh, am I going to go by Katie? Or am I going to go by Kate? Like, what am I going to do? And I don't think it was necessarily my hearing loss, but I think it was just, I was just ready for a change. I think in terms of the support services, I was very fortunate that I grew up, you know, in a very, just supportive environment. I felt that I wasn't concerned about my speech being unintelligible. I knew how to fix my hearing aids if something broke. And so I think that, and also knew knowing the class sizes were smaller at Bennett too. I just didn't feel like I was walking into this unknown territory in terms of my hearing loss.

And I also think, because my hearing loss was never something that I truly felt I like labeled me or anything like that, that going to Bennett was more because I was excited to try something new at 15.

Kathleen Colella, AuD, CCC-A (Host): Yeah. And you have the foundation laid early on and you were ready.

Katie Radasevich: Yeah, and because I did have those services for so long, you know, that they really set me up for success inside and outside the classroom.

Kathleen Colella, AuD, CCC-A (Host): So with me today is Jen Haney. And I'm going to let her introduce herself because she has such a, unique resume that she brings to our team. Go ahead, Jen.

Jen Haney: Thanks Katie. Um, so I am the Education Liaison for the Cochlear Implant Team here at Lurie Children's Hospital. Um, my role here is really to communicate with families to ensure that their child's educational programming is appropriate and workwith schools to ensure that they are meeting the needs of children with cochlear implants. So my background is in deaf education. Um, I have had the opportunity to work in an auditory oral school. I, um, was also a hearing itinerant for many years, and I also had an early childhood total communication, deaf and hard of hearing, um, classroom as well. Um, in addition to working here at Lurie, I also have a private early intervention practice where I specialize in working with families of children, birth to three, teaching parents, how to work with their newly diagnosed child with hearing loss.

Kathleen Colella, AuD, CCC-A (Host): That's amazing. You really you're really like the Haley's comet of like early intervention provider cause I know people like you don't come around that often. And then we so lucky to have you here at Lurie Children's. Um, so the first thing I want to just go over and kind of get out of the way is some of the terminology, because I think that's something that people hear these terms and they've heard of them, but they need clarification or reminders. So the big one is what is the difference between an IEP and a 504?

Jen Haney: That is a great question. So an IEP is an individualized education plan for a child with really any identified disability. And with the IEP, it provides a variety of services for a child, so thatthey're able to access the general education curriculum. And through that many times, there are a variety of service providers, including a teacher of the deaf or hearing itinerant that will work on goals that are specifically related to the child's needs. There are specific accommodations and modifications that are made for ensuring that children have optimal access in the classroom as well as testing accommodations.

So those are things that are really included in the IEP. The 504 is a little bit different in the sense that, um, it falls under ADA or Americans with Disabilities Act. And that really allows the child access environmentally to everything that they would require from a hearing standpoint. So, this would be something like basic accommodate, uh, accommodations, such as preferential seating. Use of an FM system, a note taker, closed captioning, things like that versus needing that direct instruction from a specialized teacher of the deaf or hearing itinerant where they're working on meeting goals. So, so that's kind of, uh, the biggest way that the two are different.

Kathleen Colella, AuD, CCC-A (Host): Okay. That, and I honestly, I still feel, I, I sometimes need to review those terms as much as I use them. And I hear about them because you want a child to get the right, to have the right type of services, whether which one it is. And you know, the Radasevich's have acknowledged they live in an area with great resources that they took advantage of. What advice would you give to a family though that say is from a smaller community, maybe a more rural area where they don't have all the resources just built in, how do they advocate for themselves?

Jen Haney: That's it's tough. Um, so some of these smaller districts, unfortunately, don't have these types of staff members already on hand since, um, hearing loss is such a low incidence disability. So, um, some things that I encourage families to do is before their child turns three, really reaching out to the school district in preparation, to let them know that your child has hearing loss and is going to require special services so that the school district is prepared to take on the child when, um, they get into the school district. Also a lot of it is parent driven research, you know, what types of programs are available in the area? Uh, is there specialized programming for children with hearing loss that could be available, not necessarily within the school district, but close to them? Does the school district have a cooperative that they work with that outsources professionals that have background in hearing loss? Um, so those are all kind of things I, I help navigate, um, for some of these families. And also a lot of times these families unfortunately then have to seek outside therapies, um, because sometimes the schools don't provide the service, um, even though they should be. So just navigating that as well, can be tough.

Kathleen Colella, AuD, CCC-A (Host): Have you seen families be successful when they end up moving, they find a, uh, a program that's outside of their school district. Has that worked out for a lot of families, even if they have to travel a little further?

Jen Haney: Yes. Um, the nice thing that an IEP affords to these students is transportation. In many cases, these deaf and hard of hearing programs are housed outside of the school district, which makes it difficult on families, especially with other kids to be able to drop them to and from school when the school's quite a far distance. So, um, a lot of our students do take a bus to, and from school that the IEP it's written into the IEP, so that parents don't have to worry about that.

Kathleen Colella, AuD, CCC-A (Host): And what can I, or any other clinician do to help these families who are trying to advocate? What's, you know, the best type of documentation or language we can provide?

Jen Haney: I think providing a summary of obviously the most recent audiology report is always kind of a starting point because that's the documentation that's required to move forward in the evaluation process. Also, uh, just providing families with just basic resources on how to get either, um, referred to early intervention or refer to the school district to get the evaluation process started on their end.

Kathleen Colella, AuD, CCC-A (Host): And, you know, Katie discussed that she did in-services for teachers when she was in school. Can you talk more about that? And do you think this is a useful tool for kids to do?

Jen Haney: Yes. And so this is actually a large part of my role, um, because we do have so many patients here that, um, are in private schools or don't necessarily need ongoing support by a teacher of the deaf. And so a lot of what I do is go into schools and teach mainstream teachers about the accommodations necessary to ensure that these kiddos are, you know, uh, have access to the general education. And when these students get older, they then are able to kind of talk about their own hearing loss. They're able to talk about what accommodations they personally need. That things that they find helpful in the classroom, barriers that they come up against. Um, you know, sometimes too, they want to be inconspicuous as they get older. And so kind of just, you know, talking to their teacher about how can we set up a system between the two of us where it doesn't make it obvious that I didn't hear you. So, as these kids get older and it really empowers them to talk about their own hearing loss, um, how they identify. And then also another nice thing that I do here is I go into classrooms and I in-service the classroom sometimes.

So I go in and I talk about the child's hearing loss to their peers and different ways that they can be a good friend to their peers and get any questions out of the way that these, you know, little ones have about, you know, cochlear implants, and exactly how that works and kids just ahve such interesting questions that us as adults would never think about. And so sometimes to just get that out in the open really sets, you know, a positive precedence moving forward so that the child doesn't get bullied or asked uncomfortable questions, um, and things like that.

Kathleen Colella, AuD, CCC-A (Host): And, and I know right now we're talking a lot about school age children, but you talked about your, you know, you were with a lot of children in the birth to three area, which I also think that's fascinating. I feel a lot of the therapy you do though, you are in so many ways, helping families communicate with their child and what, you know, it's hard to boil down everything into like a one minute segment of what you provide, but what is kind of like the best general advice you can do about communicating with a little one to promote positive speech and language development? And I mean, this question really to anyone like any parent, because I think we don't even realize the impact we're having when we're around these, uh, around these babies of how much they're absorbing all the time.

Jen Haney: Absolutely. So, um, the first thing that I always recommend is use of amplification during all waking hours. I mean, this is the basic foundation and if your child is getting access to the sound that they need, that's obviously going to promote, understanding and express an expression of language. I also think it's really important for them to kind of tune into their baby. So looking at what they're interested in and kind of following their lead.

Because a lot of times, if it's our agenda and what we want to do, they tune out if that's not something they're interested in. So, like I said, following the child's lead, um, talk, talk, talk. So using really short, meaningful sentences and using that throughout the routine of your day. So that every time, you know, um, you're changing your baby's diaper, you're using a lot of that same language, so that those connections are being made.

So that repetition just over and over and then reading your baby's cues. So a lot of times, you know, they're really trying to communicate with you, whether it be nonverbal or through their babble. And so many times it's easy to miss those, those cues.

Kathleen Colella, AuD, CCC-A (Host): And that's great advice for any parent of a young child of connecting and following, uh, following their lead and every baby does that at some point. And we live in such a noisy world in society now that I think it's, it is so simple though, those types of interactions, what a positive impact it makes on these little ones.

Jen Haney: Yes, absolutely. I mean, it just goes to show that really children are absorbing everything around them all the time. And so they watch what you do. Um, so if you're sweeping the floor, you know, and then a couple of weeks later, they want a broom to do the same thing, you never had to teach them how to sweep. They just kind of looked at you and learned those skills. And so it really is amazing just how much they're taking in and as a parent to really be cognizant of that.

Kathleen Colella, AuD, CCC-A (Host): They are amazing. You know, Eileen and Rudy said they were fortunate, cause Katie was one who just took to her hearing aids right away. They were able to put them in and, and she did not fight them. But unfortunately that's not the case as you and I both know, what's your quick advice you would give for a new hearing aid user who is struggling, which is completely, completely age appropriate with keeping the hearing aids in the ears?

Jen Haney: That happens very often. So I would just say, keep at it, be consistent, have a routine. We don't expect these kiddos to be wearing their amplification right off the bat from the time they wake up until the time they go to sleep. We understand that when we newly dispense equipment, that it's going to take time for these, these kiddos to get used to it, but really consistency, having a routine, taking the recommendations of things that either the therapist or the audiologist recommend things like, you know, utilizing a pilot cap to keep them from pulling out the aides or utilizing toupe tape, to keep the aids behind the ear, singing a song while you put in the aids or the cochlear implant on every morning, just taking advantage and at least trying some of these strategies before kind of saying that they're not going to be successful.

Kathleen Colella, AuD, CCC-A (Host): What's the most unique or interesting way you've seen a parent try to build consistent hearing aid use? Have you ever just been working with a child and a parent did something and you're like, oh, I never thought about that before?

Jen Haney: Yes. I had one, um, family that the ear molds kept falling out. And as many of, you know, the ear mold process, it takes quite a while for them to come in sometimes. And so these, these babies, you know, have grown out of them. So I had one family actually used band-aids and they. So they taped the ear molds into the ear, um.

Kathleen Colella, AuD, CCC-A (Host): And that worked?

Jen Haney: You know, what, it did. And I thought that it was a really creative idea to keep the ear molds in until they were able to get new ones.

Kathleen Colella, AuD, CCC-A (Host): That is a great idea, I guess it would seal it too. See we learn all the time. Give us your ideas. We need people. Well, you know, is there anything else you wanted to comment on after listening to episode two about their school journey?

Jen Haney: The best advice I think I could give to a family is it truly is a journey and there's going to be hurdles and bumps along the way. And you're constantly going to be learning something new as your child grows and gets older. But my best advice would to be, would be to kind of roll with those punches and embrace each step of the way because throughout it, you know, your child is growing and you're, you're learning with them. And so give yourself a little grace, don't be so hard on yourself because in most cases you have never had a child with hearing loss before. And so you guys are all learning together.

Kathleen Colella, AuD, CCC-A (Host): I think that's great. That's beautiful. Well, thank you Jen, for listening with me today.

Jen Haney: Thanks for having me.

Kathleen Colella, AuD, CCC-A (Host): Even though we all spent a significant amount of our childhood attending school, we are not simply defined by our education. It's time to hear more about who Katie is as a whole person. Next time on Amplified. Thanks for listening.

Amplified, presented by Lurie Childrens was created by me, Katie Colella. Music by lesfm, artwork by Katrina Graziolo. Special thanks to Jamie Budzig, Lisa Weber, Joy Ringer, Jen Haney, Danielle Lee. And of course the Radasevich and Farnsworth families. If you need resources regarding childhood hearing loss, go to Luriechildren's.org/audiology-resources. Transcripts of all episodes are available at Luriechildren's.org/ amplify. Learn more about Katie and the incredible division of rehabilitation services on Instagram @Lurierehabservices. That's @ L-U-R-I-Erehabservices.