Transcription:

Dr. Weis: All right, welcome back to another Get Wise with Weiss podcast. I've got a very special guest today. We got Dr. John Slaton who is with our independent physician management group, our IPM group, which is our employed physician group. We have delighted to have him and a number of his colleagues. First actually tell us about where's your latest office and what are you guys up to in terms of your newest gig?

Dr. John Slaton: Yeah. Well, I appreciate you having me first and foremost. We, our new office is at 5601 West I 40 here in Amarillo. It's the Northwest Physicians Group Primary Care Center. It's got eight physicians in there, seven MDs, and one DO, that would be me. And we're excited to offer primary care to everybody in Amarillo who wants to come and check it out.

Yeah, I got to see the renovated building a couple weeks ago. It is gorgeous. So, yeah. I think a lot of Amarillo residents probably know that as the old Zachary building. I used to have a big name Zachary on top and I think it was a engineering firm or something before that.

Yeah, it was. And Tas Coosa National Bank before that.

Dr. Weis: Yeah. So you guys have a massive vault in there. So any ideas what you're gonna do with that vault?

Dr. John Slaton: Well, we got the x-ray put in there.

Dr. Weis: Fantastic. It's spectacular. Well, it is a beautiful place. And we got great physicians there. So, but you know, the big thing, as you pointed out, it's interesting you said there's seven MDs and then you as a DO that. I've been in this business a few years and I've had the privilege of working with a lot of DOs over the years and seeing a lot more in the medical field in terms of, particularly in Texas here. So what does DO stand for?

Dr. John Slaton: It stands for Doctor of Osteopathy, and you're gonna ask me next, what does that mean, right? I get that question a lot. And basically what it is it is a medical doctor who goes through all the same training, all the same classes as an md. We do one additional class in medical school that is about 200 plus hours more of musculoskeletal training that allows us to do osteopathic manual manipulation, which is a treatment that not everybody's a candidate for, but is a potential tool in our tool belt to help treat musculoskeletal issues and problems that may pop up as well as other systemic issue it can help with. So, it is not a doctor that is below an MD. It is definitely an equivalent to an MD .

There are patients out there that look particularly for DOs because they cannot take traditional medications, traditional treatments, and so they seek out people who can perform manual manipulation. Other people liken us to chiropractors. Chiropractors don't go through all of the medical school training that we do. They certainly get a lot of musculoskeletal training. We kind of take the chiropractic training, blend it in with the medical school training and boom. You got a DO.

Dr. Weis: Absolutely. I've had the benefit of having my wife Joanna Wilson is a DO, and so I, through her I've learned a lot about the background of that. It's, in essence, it's a philosophy of medicine, if you will. I mean, we talk about MD's practicing allopathic medicine. Correct. And then do's, practicing osteopathic medicine and this idea of really we look back at the history of medicine, there's been all these philosophies. Years ago they thought that, pathology or sickness was due to bad humors in the body. And that we would bleed someone to get those bad humors out. Thankfully, those days are gone Right. So, but like I said, it's a different philosophy as to. . What makes us well or keeps us well.

Dr. John Slaton: Yeah. The key tenant is that structure is related to function. And so that is hammered home in, osteopathic medical school, is that the main philosophy is structure is related to function. So when you have a certain pathology going on in the body, what we try to focus on is, is there not only the disease pathology itself, but what is, what structurally needs to be fixed or manipulated in order to help the body function correctly. In addition to taking medication or in addition to taking antibiotics through our physical exam, we can see is there anything structurally that needs to be fixed in order to allow the body to function better?

Dr. Weis: Absolutely. Absolutely. And as you pointed out, I think, anyone that's had, let's say a painful leg knows that if you start to favor that leg, all of a sudden your back starts to hurt. Or your other leg starts to hurt. And as you point out The body is designed a particular way, and it's that balance of that structure that's so important to the function of the entire body. And that when one area gets kind of lack of a turn outta whack, then it throws everything else off too. It sure can.

Dr. John Slaton: It sure can. what we know is that when something is off, everything is connected, everything. And so, As you stated, when a leg is hurting, we start overcompensating on the other side, we start getting back pain or hip pain on the other side. If we can fix the structural issue of that leg, then we can avoid all of the other problems. And so that is something that a do will look for. MDs actually are starting to get into this as well. There are manual manipulation classes and certifications that MDs can go through now too. So it's not just a, crackpot idea that it used to be thought of. It is something that is actually more accepted these days and so it is something that many patients seek out and I'm proud to be able to offer it at our primary care center.

Dr. Weis: Fantastic. Oh, no, absolutely. I mean, I have talked some past podcasts about, Just the value of physical therapy that I've seen in my patients and referring patients for, physical therapy, physical manipulation and how, what an amazing job that can do in helping people with their ailments. You made a particularly important point which is, As a, do you have all the training that MDs have. Which mystifies me because I thought Boy, medical school was as packed as it could be. How could you fit another 200 hours of yet another class like, like you guys do, which is incredible. But you know, obviously you have the same training. You pass all the same exams. that, MDs do. Yeah, I said you are equivalent to any MD with that additional training, which is just a tracker.

Dr. John Slaton: That is correct. That is correct. All the certifications, all of the licensing, state licensing exams are the same. Residency programs There's one single accreditation system for all the residency programs, whereas in the past they used to be different. And so really it, it's kind. It's mainstreamed now to where there, there really isn't that much of a difference between MDs and DOs anymore. With the only remaining difference being that philosophy and the amount of training in musculoskeletal systems.

Dr. Weis: Absolutely. Now, which osteopathic school did you go to?

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Dr. John Slaton: went to the University of North Texas.

Dr. Weis: Okay. So, and I was gonna say that is the one I think in this area that most of us know as a tcom. That is great the other day. And It's interesting. My wife, her father was a professor of physiology that helped start that school many, many years ago. No. A fantastic school. Yes. And we are, privileged to have a lot of physicians in this area that have gone through Tcom. Now tell me, people know that when doctors go to medical school, that's four years. and then they have to choose their specialty. That be family medicine, internal medicine, orthopedics and they do this residency program. And the residency program is where you get that subspecialty training, and that can range from three up to seven years, like neurosurgeons. Are there specific osteopathic residency programs or is it at that point, do people who come outta a do school go into the scene residencies that MDs would go to?

Dr. John Slaton: So in the past there used to be osteopathic only residency programs, that's not so much a thing anymore. Now osteopathic doctors have the ability to go to all the same residency programs that MDs do, and so you, again, the training is remarkably similar. Depending on the program you go to, the residency program may offer some opportunities to further that osteopathic manual manipulation training. Other programs may not have as much of that if they're not familiar with DOs as much. However as far as the rest of the medical training is concerned, residency programs are, they're all streamlined for both MDs and DOs now. Yeah. There really is no difference.

Dr. Weis: I know when I did my residency, there were several DOs I worked with in my residency, so Absolutely. It was great to hear their viewpoint on a lot of different conditions saying, I think we, this is something maybe avoid using medications and use a manipulation or, or physical, therapy for.

Dr. John Slaton: Yeah. You would be so surprised how many patients actually don't like it when they go to an er, an urgent care or primary care doctor and muscle relaxers are thrown at them and said, okay, it'll get better here in just a few days. ] No if we can do something in the office to maybe help relieve their pain. Right there and then without having to take a medication. Most patients I think, prefer that. Yeah. Or at least that's been my experience. And so, it is welcomed by most of the population once they figure out what it is. Yeah.

Dr. Weis: Fantastic. Is there, do you have any special equipment in your office that allows you to do manipulation?

Dr. John Slaton: Nothing too special. We have a chiropractic, you know, manipulation table that we use to, to kind of do our adjustments on. I'm a big fan of tins units. I use that a lot to kind of loosen up soft tissues and muscles before we start manipulating, doing spinal adjustments or, or soft tissue adjustments. Other than that, ? No, not really.

Dr. Weis: Well, and I've heard you know, with the manip tables that people talk about. So that is kind of a special table for you to be able to do?

They are, they have a firm back to them so

Dr. John Slaton: that when you apply pressure, you're not, you're, there's not too much cushion there. So, when we need to adjust a spine, for example, I need something. to lay a patient on. It's not that it's uncomfortable, it's just gotta, it's gotta firm back to it. If we, a lot of these exam tables have too much cushion. So if I try to really push on somebody, There's too much Give.

Dr. Weis: Yes, yes. So, as an md, I find patients come in with aches and pains and all stuff, and I'm looking, they got 24 medicines already and I'm thinking, gosh, do I really want to add another medicine , try to fix them. So, absolutely. So this is fantastic. So let's say I'm a. and I'm interested in manipulation. How do I seek you out and how do I make you aware that, boy, I'd really like to consider this alternative therapy?

Dr. John Slaton: Absolutely. If you have chronic pain, if you have headaches, if you have back pain, joint pains, anything along those lines. , the first thing to do is, let's see if you're even a candidate for therapy. Because there are some conditions like osteoporosis and other autoimmune type diseases that maybe it's not the best that we do spinal adjustments and things like that, we can still consider soft tissue adjustments and, and other ways, but the traditional thought is that if you go to a DO or you go to a chiropractor, you're gonna get popped.

You know, that's Or cracked. Not everybody's a candidate for that. Correct. And so, we need to make sure that you're a candidate and based on our exam, we can determine what you would be a candidate for. And Kind of give you those options and allow you to decide along with your primary care physician you know what needs to be done and if if medication is not your thing that's great because osteopathic manipulation doesn't require medication.

Dr. Weis: So I've had a lot of patients go to chiropractors and have received great care from chiropractors. We have some excellent chiropractors in the community. But, it tends not to be a one and done. You, it is kind of have to go for repeat sessions or treatments. Is that the same with what you do? Is it a series of where you, you have to have people come back and maybe redo what you did? Or?

Dr. John Slaton: It can be, it depends on what we're treating. It depends if it's an acute injury. It's possible that it could be a one and done type of therapy. If it's more of a chronic issue then it is possible that we need repeat treatments. It just kind of depends on the individual and what they have going on. But I can tell you I've had multiple people come in with just splitting headaches or just really debilitating back pain. And we've been able to get things calmed down in one visit to a point where they can function better. And these are people that have been to the ER, the urgent care multiple, multiple times, had all sorts of pain medication and muscle relaxers thrown at them and said, good luck, . And we've been able to kind of calm it down get them back to work, which is, what most people are worried about, or functioning better to a point where they don't need to rely on medications anymore. And I've had several people come in and have that type of success and it's been really gratifying to see.

Dr. Weis: Fantastic. I tell you, I think all of us that have worked in the primary care. Field understand back pain is so common and people come in and that gets usually one of their top two complaints and it's miserable. I mean, people are really debilitating and clearly we were not meant to stand upright. At some point our ancestors made a big mistake there. But How about now? I know sometimes we have doctors listening to this. If I'm a primary care physician, can I refer to you as an, as another primary care physician, but with this added, skillset to take care of a patient of mine and then have them come back to see me?

Dr. John Slaton: Absolutely. Absolutely. You can. In fact most of my partners will refer to me and that's all I will do. I'm not trying to take the place of your primary care provider. If you come to me from a referral standpoint, from your other primary care provider, I will treat your back pain or muscle spasms or whatever it is they referred. Four, and then I will send you back to your primary care provider for all of your other chronic care and preventative care needs. I'm not trying to step on any toes or take over but I am happy to see any patient that comes from another primary care provider for that purpose.

Dr. Weis: Fantastic. Now, I can think of almost half dozen, at least other DOs immediately in this community from cardiologists to other primary care doc. So it's a great collaborative relationship between the MDs and DOs. Absolutely. And I, I really appreciate you coming. Help us clarify what does that mean, because people just don't quite understand what a DO does or what that background is.

Dr. John Slaton: And until you have it done, a lot of. Won't know. I can sit here and explain it until I'm blue in the face. But if you have ever been treated with osteopathic manual manipulation, you won't ever forget it. It's it, and I have a lot of patients that come back just because I was able to do that for them and it's a different level of physical exam. In the exam room, physician will examine a patient and spend a minimal to moderate amount of time doing the exam. DOs in my experience, especially with musculoskeletal complaints, take a little bit more time and it's in our training, that's what they hammer home in osteopathic medical school. And that's not to say our MD counterparts don't do a good job with physical exams.

Of course they do. But in order to do this manipulative therapy, we have to pay attention to certain things that I don't think MDs get all that well trained in tissue texture changes. Inflammation along the paraspinal musculature. How we manipulate that, how we move that, how that affects overall function is just something that we don't talk about in the allopathic world. And so, it's a different level of physical exam and patients have remarked to me how much time I will spend examining their back, examining each vertebrae, making note of what I'm finding and exactly how I'm going to fix it. And again, very gratifying to see that they say, no physician has ever examined me that way. Well, that's great actually.

Dr. Weis: I can tell you as from my MD training, our training was sparse on that kind of stuff compared to what you had the skillset you have. So, absolutely. And, but I also know too that, that not all do. sustain that particular trainee. So that's the other thing. I think people, listeners, I know. If someone has a DO behind their name, they're a physician, but they may not still have maintained the manipulation skills like you have. So for people to ask beforehand.

Dr. John Slaton: Absolutely. It's one tool in our tool belt. . And so, if they have a DO behind their name, absolutely they went through that training in medical school, but depending on the residency they went through, what specialty they are and even in primary care, not all DOs choose to carry on this type of therapy. Sometimes they maybe did it in residency a little bit. And then once they get out the private practice, they decide, eh I'm, this is not for me anymore. And so absolutely it is important to ask, do you offer this type of therapy? Not all DOs do.

Dr. Weis: Yeah. Fantastic. Well, that's great. we're coming at the end of time here, but thank you so much. Anything else you would. Tell us about in terms of maybe I've missed in terms of, the experience of being an osteopathic physician.

Dr. John Slaton: I think being an osteopathic physician again is just something that, it's given me a lot of joy to be able to see people get better without medication in a lot of instances, it doesn't always work. It's not foolproof but it is something that we can offer that is different, that is an alternative to traditional medical therapies. If you would like to come check it out, come see us our new primary care center and I'd be happy to see you and we'll see what we can do.

Dr. Weis: Fantastic. Well, Dr. Slaton, thank you so much for your time and please if for listeners you have to check out this facility up on I 40. It is awesome. There. It is. Gorgeous. Absolutely gorgeous. And we got many great providers there and obviously including Dr. Slaton. So well, thank you so much for your time and we will see you next time on Getting Wise with Weis.

Dr. John Slaton: Thank you for having me. Thank you.