Helen Dandurand (Host): Welcome back to the Well Within Reach podcast. I'm your host, Helen Dandurand. And today, I'm going to be joined by Dr. Hamzeh Badwan, family medicine provider at Riverside's Watseka campus, to chat about breaking the stigma for men's mental health.

My Chart Ad: Healthcare can be confusing, but thanks to your myRiverside myChart, you can easily manage not only your care, but your family's as well. With a single click, your myRiverside myChart lets you stay well connected to the same information your provider sees. You can view your health history, get test results, request prescription refills, pay your bill, or make an appointment. Manage your care from anywhere, your laptop, phone, or tablet. Learn more and enroll today at riversidemychart.org.

Host: And we're back with Dr. Badwan. Thanks for joining me today.

Hamzeh Badwan, MD: Anytime. It's my pleasure to be here with you guys.

Host: Good, good. We're excited to talk to you today. Before we get started, I know you've done a podcast with us before, but could you tell us, for anyone new listening, a little bit about your background?

Hamzeh Badwan, MD: Yeah. So, I'm actually from Lockport, Illinois, which is not too far north up here. Graduated in 2006. I followed Southern Illinois for my undergraduate, and then I went to University of Arkansas for my residency, and I've been working here in Watseka for two and a half years, and I'm loving it.

Host: Awesome, cool. So, we'll just go ahead and get started into the topic we're talking about today, and that is men's mental health and the stigma around it. And to start off, could you just tell us a little bit, like, address why men's mental health is so important and how that differs just from the general topic of mental health?

Hamzeh Badwan, MD: So, mental health in men is a really difficult topic to bring up because men have been stigmatized of not bringing this up. A lot of men have been told that men don't cry, men don't complain, men shouldn't feel down. And if you do, then there's something wrong with you. This is an old antiquated philosophy from the '60s and '70s. Men are just as at risk of women and adolescents for depression, anxiety, bipolar, insomnia. And really, you know, with the human body, if the brain isn't working correctly, the whole body is not going to work correctly. So, I just wanted to talk a little bit about bringing awareness to this conversation because that's the first step, is being aware that men do suffer from depression, anxiety, bipolarism, insomnia, panic disorder. And it's okay if you do because you're not alone and thank God we have doctors that will prescribe and treat you to make your life a lot better, and the quality of life's really where I'm at. So, it's one of those topics, as you say, it's hard for men to complain, period. Usually, they don't go to the doctor until their limbs are falling off.

Host: Right.

Hamzeh Badwan, MD: So, this is just something we can do to bring awareness to all the men out there, regardless of their age, whether they're 19 or 79, 89 or 99. It affects everyone. We're all human beings.

Host: Absolutely. You kind of mentioned a few of maybe the societal expectations that men don't cry or this or that. Do you have any others that you can think of from a man's perspective that kind of influence their willingness to speak up?

Hamzeh Badwan, MD: Men are stoic by nature. They feel like if they complain about something, it's a sign of weakness. However, that is just not true. Because, like I said before, if your brain and mental health is not optimized, well, then you're going to have other issues. For example, you're going to have fatigue, you may misuse drugs or alcohol, you may have anger problems, you may have increased physical symptoms like headache, digestive problems, IBS, irritable bowel, whether that's diarrhea dominant or constipation dominant. And then, they might do a lot of escaping behavior where they will seclude themselves from their family and loved ones in order not to have anyone bear their pain. Because a lot of men think if they complain about something that other people will feel bogged down by that. But the truth of the matter is, it's the opposite. You have friends and family to support you in times of need.

So, a lot of people also might have difficulty concentrating, feeling restless. You may have Insomnia. And a lot of times, men are not aware that this is actually maybe depression or some type of a mood disorder that can be treated with simple things and we don't always have to go into medicine. We could do cognitive behavioral therapy, yoga, different sports. There's a plenty of conservative management that does not require medications because a lot of guys are like, "Well, I don't want to be on meds." And that's okay. We can try some other treatment options first. And if that fails, then we can go ahead and try some medication to get them back where they need to be.

Host: Absolutely. And yeah, some of those symptoms you listed, I think, even men and women would think that's kind of part of life, part of getting older all of the above. And so, just to know that, "Hey, it isn't normal to be tired all the time, it isn't this or that," and not a big deal to have a conversation, you know, about it.

Hamzeh Badwan, MD: Exactly. And these feelings, for example, depression, you may feel sad, hopeless, empty, they're not normal to have. You may have a thought or two, but ideally we want to have happiness in our life. And if you're not getting any happiness in your life, there may be something more going on, and I'd definitely recommend going to your family physician or any provider that you have capabilities to go get evaluated. These are easy things to screen out for with simple questionnaires, and it will have life-changing effects once we get your mind right. And then, you'll see everything else kind of falls into place like a puzzle.

Host: Absolutely. We're going to take a quick break. I'm going to talk a little bit about finding the right primary care provider for you.

Riverside knows that health is your greatest asset and that your primary care provider is your partner in health. Find a primary care provider that fits your needs at riversidehealthcare.org/primarycare.

Okay. And jumping back into it, you were just kind of talking about getting help when you need it. Could you tell us a little bit about what you think the steps would be that you recommend someone who thinks they're having these issues to take? Should you talk to a friend first? Should you go ahead and schedule with your PCP?

Hamzeh Badwan, MD: Yeah. So, I think that's a great question because we want to have privacy and a lot of times guys might not feel comfortable talking to their best friend or their brother or whoever it may be about this. So, that's when you need to go to the professionals, okay? And get out everything and speak to them and we'll be able to help you with those emotions and those thoughts.

I just want to bring up a couple of numbers here that's interesting. Males, 6 million American men are affected by depression a year. That is a lot of men because only 20% of those will actually get treatment or go to a doctor. And the problem with that is 80% of people who die by suicide are males. So, it's four times higher rate. So, a lot of times by the time they're suicidal, it's really gone off the deep end. So, we want to get it before it gets that bad. And the primary way to do that is to go talk to your doctor, honestly. And the main reason is men will not feel comfortable bringing this up with their wife or their sister or their brother or even their friends. You know, the stigma, it goes back to the stigma. Men need to tough it out. Men are strong and they shouldn't complain. Truth of the matter is men are human beings too and we have all the same feelings that everyone else has and we need to make it acceptable for men to get up and say this is what's going on.

And let me just say one thing about the stigma. A real man will actually be in touch with his feelings and not deny anything and they will not bury anything. That's childlike behavior. So as a man, as a woman, we need to feel free to vocalize and articulate what's on the inside, and that is mature and growth.

Host: Right. And that's especially, I think, another reason why finding like a primary care provider that you feel comfortable with, that you feel like is kind of like a friend to you, you can talk with, it's so important because then you'll feel more apt to, you know, speak about these things that are kind of deep and personal, and it's important to make sure you have your thoughts straight when you are going into that kind of setting. Like, perhaps, writing down, "These are the things that I'm experiencing" to make sure that you can actually communicate them in that setting. Because I know it's hard even when you're just running to your doctor for something to remember, you know, something not so personal. Just to be like, "Oh, yeah. And by the way, I had this and this." So, writing it down so you remember exactly what you wanted to say makes things a little bit easier, I've found.

Hamzeh Badwan, MD: Absolutely. And you hit the nail on the head there. A lot of men feel lonely and they're never going to say that. So, a lot of times, we have to kind of get it out of them in a physical exam. But you, kind of hit it right where you want a good relationship with your primary care physician, where you're able to comfortably talk without any limitations or anything like that where you could actually just speak what's on your mind. And if you don't have that relationship with your doctor, then then maybe you should find someone where you have that trust. Because that open line of communication is key for treatment.

Host: Yeah, absolutely. What kind of advice do you have for family or friends of men, like women, who might be struggling to have these conversations? How can they support and encourage their loved ones to prioritize their health?

Hamzeh Badwan, MD: Always check in on them in terms of how they're doing. You don't want to be too aggressive because then they're just going to kind of run away and deny it. But just bringing up the awareness of, "Hey, it's okay if you're sad. And it's okay if you're not feeling good," this is a human quality and we all feel it and if it gets to the point where it's affecting your day to day activity. A lot of my patients tell me, "Well, of course I have episodes of anxiety or feeling sad sometimes." And the truth is, yeah, you're going to. But if it starts to affect your day to day activity, whether it's your job, your family, your kids, that's when we need to treat you, and likely more aggressively with medications. There are plenty of medications. It's 2024 almost, and there's a lot of new medications that don't have the profile of the old antidepressants have. In the '80s and '90s, a lot of them caused sexual dysfunction or impotence and that's why a lot of men didn't want to be on antidepressants. Now, however, that's not the case. We have new medications that work amazingly.

And one thing I wanted to add before I let you guys go is a lot of times mood disorders and anxiety have comorbid conditions like thyroid issues or ADHD or insomnia or palpitations or heart disease. So, please just talk to your doctor, have them run some labs. Make sure that it's coming from your mental health and not a physical issue.

Host: Cool. Yeah, that's good to know and good to take stock. I mean, before I think you mentioned some symptoms where it's like, "Oh, I didn't know that was related." And then, now even saying like, "Oh, it might not be related. It's just good to get it checked out from a professional to know exactly what's going on with you." So, I think that's super important. You mentioned a little bit of this before. But just to hop back into it, what are some things that you kind of recommend? Say it's not quite to the level of needing medication, this or that, what are like some of the best things that you see that people do that kind of changed their life?

Hamzeh Badwan, MD: One, becoming aware of your feelings to not trap them inside because when you trap them inside, they will spill out in other ways. You will snap at a wife for no reason, she's just calling you or something, you know. Easy things they can do is to become aware of your feelings, one. Two, have healthy escape options, whether that's working out, doing yoga, meditating, listening to heavy metal, or classic music, it doesn't matter. It matters what's going on in your brain. And a lot of times, you have so much thoughts that meditating, meaning thinking of nothing, focusing on your breath, can be almost impossible for people. But these are some natural remedies. We don't need to go into medicine right away. There's a lot of research done on yoga, deep breathing exercises, and even working out. You don't need to go and lift 300 pounds. Just get out there and move.

Host: Absolutely. I think that's really helpful for people to kind of think about and know. Is there anything else that you want to add today on this topic?

Hamzeh Badwan, MD: I just want to thank you for giving me the opportunity to put this out and bring awareness to mental health in men. It's long overdue. And if you guys need anything, you know where I'm at. I'm at Riverside in Watseka. And I just want to thank you guys again, and it's a pleasure being here.

Host: Absolutely. We're really glad you're able to be on today. And thank you listeners for tuning into the Well Within Reach podcast brought to you by Riverside Healthcare. For more information, visit riversidehealthcare.org/primarycare.