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Prakash Chandran (Host): Nursing requires a commitment to a higher calling as a compassionate leader. St. Joseph's Health works every day to make their health system a place where people know their values, their opportunities and their impact. But what exactly does it look like to have a career at St. Joseph's Health? We're going to talk about it today with Dr. Jamie Kabanuk, St. Joseph's Chief Nursing Officer and Suzanne Talarico, the Talent Acquisition Manager, and an RN at St. Joseph's Health. This is St. Joseph's Health Med Cast, the podcast from St. Joseph's Health. My name is Prakash Chandran, and so Dr. Kabanuk and Suzanne, thank you so much for joining us today. Truly appreciate your time. Dr. Kabanuk, I was hoping to start with you. How exactly is the culture at St. Joseph's Health different from other hospitals?

Jamie Kabanuk, DNP, MSN, RN, NEA-BC (Guest): Here at St. Joseph's Health, our nurses and our bedside colleagues have a voice in their care or in the care that we provide to our patients at the bedside. Our nurses are invited and respected and influenced to drive the decision-making process. We have opportunities in our unit-based councils and our shared governance committees at the hospital-wide level to be involved in the shared decision making process and have a direct impact on the care models and providing care to our patients and their families.

Suzanne Talarico, RN, BSN, RACR (Guest): We also have a strong commitment to our mission, vision, and values. And we promote that a lot in our recruitment efforts. Really kind of talking about how we're here in service to others. We kind of believe in a higher purpose and calling, really how we can be the best when people are at their most vulnerable and to really look at how we can serve the common good of our community.

Host: Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. And Dr. Kabanuk you started talking about this in your first answer, but a lot of this seems to be around helping nurses feel like they have the autonomy to make the right decisions. But how specifically would you say St. Joseph's Hospital helps nurses to thrive?

Dr. Kabanuk: Here at St. Joseph Health, our nurses, you're right they have the ability to really perform and be individuals at the bedside, to be advocates for their patients and to be involved in the decisions that we're making around our care delivery systems. We really promote the shared governance model, cross-training and educational development. We provide the ability to have mentorship and leadership opportunities and access to managemen while they're here in many different roles in patient care.

Host: Now Dr. Kabanuk, I have heard of the term magnet-designated hospital before, but I was hoping you could first and foremost, tell us a little bit about what that means and the advantages of working at one like St. Joseph's.

Dr. Kabanuk: Yeah, thank you. So we're very proud of our magnet-designation here at St. Joseph's. It's really much more than just a logo or something that we're able to put on our website. It's a designated program that has shown that our nurses here and our program here at St. Joseph's is really a higher level of care. It is shown that facilities that are magnet-designated, they have a higher level of job satisfaction. They have increased opportunities for development for professionals, and they have a higher level of safety. And then also a lower patient mortality rate.

Suzanne: From the recruitment perspective, the magnet-designation is really key. We do have a lot of nurses who reach out specifically because they have seen that we are a magnet-designated hospital and they do know all of the things that Jamie said about having higher job satisfaction, different opportunities for that professional development. And knowing that the clinical outcomes are higher than organizations that are not magnet-designated. So we do get a lot of nurse staff as well as other staff, because they know what it means to be a part of a nursing magnet-designated hospital that will reach out to us specifically because of that.

Host: Suzanne, in speaking about this, cause it seems like this is a consideration that nurses make when coming to a hospital, for magnet-designation, is there like a yearly audit? How does a hospital actually go about getting that and maintaining that over time?

Suzanne: The initial designation is really very labor-intensive. There's a lot of criteria. It's a very stringent process that the ANCC you know, we have a lot of criteria for which that we have to meet and show that our outcomes are of a certain standard, that our nurse retention, satisfaction and turnover are at a certain level. You know, it's a huge document. Jamie can probably speak to that as well, but it's, you know, like a thousand page submission to be able to be considered. And then there's a site visit. And then there is a reaccreditation process, which we're actually just launching into. We have a designated person actually on site, who one of their key functions of their role is really committed to ensuring that we have all of the documentation for this redesignation process because it is so extensive. And it really is, you know, it's not just a given that once you receive this designation that you will continue to receive it. There are times when organizations may lose that designation and have to resubmit again. So it really a testament to the quality of care, the type of nursing, the culture and the environment to be able to not only obtain, but then to maintain a magnet-designation.

Host: Yeah. That sounds absolutely amazing. So Dr. Kabanuk, I wanted to ask how do nurses participate in innovating patient care.

Dr. Kabanuk: Yeah. There are different modalities that nurses can be involved in. One of them is through our shared governance committees. That's a meeting of our professionals that come together around process improvement, quality, or even recruitment tasks or interventions here at the hospital. But we welcome anybody that wants to join our professional practice councils. Also through rounding, we do a great deal of rounding with our staff. And during that time, our leaders, we discuss the real items. What's working well, what needs improvement? What are the solutions that our bedside colleagues have for improvement in these areas? So, there's a great deal of direct conversation. And then there's opportunities to be involved in professional development areas. And you know, you can have pathways to move from being at the bedside and to management or leadership and get involved in those ways as well.

Suzanne: Yeah, I would agree, I think to Jamie's point earlier about really having a voice in patient care. I think that the rounding that our CNO, Jamie does has really been critical and being able to get feedback from the staff when things are working, when things are not working, how things might work better. We hear all the time in recruitment, people that have been here and left for a variety of reasons and we call them boomerangs when they consider coming back and do come back. But they do come back, because they do think that the way that we do things here, that they do have a stronger voice in that patient care, that they are able to make those decisions that the innovative care that they bring forward is actually put into practice. They really do have that sense. And when they have gone to other places, they don't see that same type of practice.

Host: Now, Suzanne, I wanted to talk a little bit about the support for bedside nursing staff. Can you talk a little bit about how leadership goes about supporting them?

Suzanne: From our perspective, through the recruitment lens you know, we can certainly see to Jamie's point again, the different opportunities. So being in a magnet organization, being in an organization this size, there are different leadership opportunities. And sometimes people might think that they are a little bit hesitant to move forward with that because they're not sure about the support that they might get, or they might want to not offend their current manager by leaving a certain area.

But I think, speaking again to the culture of St. Joe's is that we really do promote and support that ability to elevate the nursing practice. And while certainly nobody wants to lose a good nurse in their department at the bedside on their particular unit, recognizing that, you know, it's a good thing for the organization overall to be able to move somebody into a different level or role where they get to continue to you know, explore their different gifts in the nursing practice and be able to really present that in a different way.

So, you know, I think our leadership is very supportive of that. They're very willing to have conversations about different opportunities and be open to that while not making people feel uncomfortable for wanting to explore different opportunities.

Dr. Kabanuk: Yeah, I completely agree with Suzanne and that answer. It's important for us that our staff feel empowered at all the levels to connect with their supervisors in their current role and learn of opportunities for professional development, but also when they are looking to take that next step, that we have a pathway available for them, and a clear journey of how they're going to get from point A to point B. It's important and essential for our nursing team and our other colleagues to have a career for life here at St. Joseph's Health.

Host: Dr. Kabanuk, we've talked about a number of different things here from career development to having a voice in care to helping drive decision-making process. But I think the question is always, does management actually listen, right? Is that something that you can speak to?

Dr. Kabanuk: Yes. It is absolutely essential for leadership to listen to colleagues and all roles within the facility. And I can tell you from firsthand experience that this does happen. We encourage our staff members to reach out, share their voice, share their ideas with us, but then we also make sure that we follow up. For instance, if a good idea has come to fruition and we're going to implement that strategy or that initiative, we want the colleagues at the bedside to be involved at every step of the way, but we also want to follow up and make sure that they know, that their idea was good and that we utilized it and have them take pride and celebrate what they were able to bring to the table.

Suzanne: And I would also add, on the flip side of that is when there's a voice in regards to a patient concern maybe about care or about safety, we do pride ourselves on being a very safe organization. An organization that really prides itself on the reporting of events that might contribute to anything that would impact the level of safe care that we provide. So ensuring that colleagues feel safe, bringing those concerns forward as well, and having that voice and knowing that it's followed up on. I know that's something that Jamie is very passionate about and has been really working to ensure that level of voice is heard as well.

Host: Now, Suzanne, just speaking about encouraging people to report and really have their voices heard; one thing that I feel like is often pushed to the wayside, especially in this profession, is mental health. I would love for you to address how you care for the mental health of your employees.

Suzanne: Oh, that's a good one. I think everyone's sort of feeling it in this time, certainly it's been a tough couple of years and every level of the organization is sort of feeling that healthcare has then undergoing a huge transformation. And I think everybody kind of agrees. We're not going back to the way it was that we're kind of having to move forward.

But one of the things that, you know, it is really nice to be able to promote when we're recruiting for St. Joe's is that colleague wellness really is a priority. PTO and benefits are available to begin on day one. There's really a lot of encouragement to ensure that you are taking time off when you can. There's preferred scheduling models so that you're able to sort of cluster your work schedule to whatever works for you. You know, there's certainly nurses that like to work three 12-hour shifts in a row because that's what works for them. And then they have that time to decompress on the off-time. There's ones that want to have every other day. But there are ways to really kind of work within what works for everyone's individual mental health, wellbeing, ability to be resilient kind of what works for them.

Dr. Kabanuk: Yeah. I agree that our colleague wellness committee is very active and involved around the facility and specific units that see a high level of patients. And during the height of COVID and our COVID departments as well. We also do encourage flexible scheduling and staff, we take a look at our staff ratios and make sure that they're manageable as well.

Host: So Dr. Kabanuk this has been a truly informative conversation. Is there anything else that you wanted to share with our audience just in regards to considering being part of the St. Joseph's Health family?

Dr. Kabanuk: I think it's important for everybody that is in health care to just remember, think back and reflect on themselves and remember why they came into the healthcare on their healthcare journey. And when it's in nursing, why did you become a nurse? We talk a lot about understanding our personal why, and being able to connect with our patients. It's important to have this connection within healthcare. It makes our patients feel safe. It makes families feel engaged and it helps with the wellness and wellbeing of our colleagues as well.

Host: And Suzanne I'll ask that same question of you.

Suzanne: Yeah, I guess I would echo what Jamie said and also I'll say again, we do have a lot of folks who come back because, you know, as we say, the grass isn't always greener and we're fortunate to have a CNO who really does recognize all of those things about nursing. And really does value nurses having a voice in patient care, having that level of autonomy at the bedside, being able to promote the connection to purpose.

Again I, kind of started off with we're here for service to others. We believe that we do have a higher purpose and being able to continuously reflect on what that is and work in an environment such as St. Joseph's Health, that gives you that ability to do that, promotes, supports and really fosters that. It's really a great opportunity to be part of the St Joseph's and Trinity Health System.

Host: Well, I think that is the perfect place to end. Dr. Kabanuk and Suzanne, thank you so much for your time today.

Dr. Kabanuk: Thank you.

Suzanne: Thank you.

Host: That was Dr. Jamie Kabanuk, Saint Joseph's Chief Nursing Officer and Suzanne Talarico, the Talent Acquisition Manager and RN at St. Joseph's. For more information, you can visit sjhsyr.org. Once again, that is sjhsyr.org. If you found this podcast to be helpful, please share it on your social channels and be sure to check out the entire podcast library for topics of interest to you. This has been St. Joseph's Health Med Cast St. Joseph's Health. My name is Prakash Chandran. Thank you. so much. And we'll talk next time.