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Jamie Kondis, MD, FAAP (Guest): Hi, this is Jamie Kondis. I'm a pediatrician at St. Louis Children's Hospital, specializing in Pediatric Emergency Medicine and Child Abuse Pediatrics. And I'm one of the Mom Docs.

Melanie Cole (Host): Hey, welcome to the Mom Docs, the podcast from St. Louis Children's Hospital. Today, we are talking about parenting myths and wives tales, and joining me is Dr. Kondis. So, thank you so much for being with us today. I couldn't love this topic more if I'd come up with it myself. So, Dr. Kondis, let's dive right in.

Dr. Kondis: Thank you. I'm so excited about this topic too.

Host: Oh, it's so much fun for parents to listen to. And so many of them are believable in some ways. So, chicken soup can cure the common cold. Now I am a Jewish woman, so I have heard this particular thing since I was a kid. And I actually believe this one. Tell me what you think.

Dr. Kondis: So, of those different wives tales we're going to talk about, I will say this one actually has the most truth to it, and I'm glad you mentioned being Jewish because it was actually the Egyptian Jewish physician and philosopher who first advised people to consume chicken soup, to relieve a respiratory tract symptoms back in the 12th century. He wrote about it. So, I did a little digging on this. And apparently more recently than the 12th century, just in the past several years, there have been some studies on whether or not chicken soup cures the common cold, and the thought was that the reason why Maimonides actually prescribed it is because back then nutrition wasn't as good.

And he recognized that just giving people a soup with a lot of chicken and vegetables and broth and everything would give them the nutrition that they needed to fight off infections. And so that's why people actually saw it working back then because they were just getting better nutrition than they would normally get. And that was helping them fight off infections. But actually, it was actually studied in like a double blind sort of study of chicken soup versus not. And it turned out that it does help people get over a cold symptoms a little bit faster. And what physicians think is because it has some ingredients in it that has some anti-inflammatory qualities that help fight off infection.

So, if you're making chicken soup, you want to add the ingredients garlic, onion and ginger. Those are the ingredients that they found have some different properties that help fight off infections such as the rhinovirus, which causes the common cold.

Host: Well, it's also a hot liquid that feels good. And I, you know, the chicken fat, I don't know about putting ginger in my chicken soup. I've never really done that, but I'm telling you what my chicken soup rocks and will make anyone feel better. So, on to vaccines. Speaking of viruses, can a child get their vaccines if they are sick, if they have a mild virus, if they have a cold or something along those lines?

Dr. Kondis: Yes. I think that this wives tale came up because people thought that vaccines themselves might make you sick. And so that if your child was already sick with a fever or cold or vomiting or diarrhea, that they shouldn't get something that might make it the more sick. But the CDC and the American Academy of Pediatrics actually say that there are no contraindications to getting vaccines if you're a little bit ill, if even if you have a mild fever, if you have a cold, if you have a stomach bug or anything like that. Because the percentage of viral particles or bacterial particles in a vaccine are so small, that is not going to make any difference. And they would much rather kids get their vaccines at the prescribed times, then put them off because they might be ill, especially with little kids, infants, toddlers, they get sick a lot anyway, in those first couple of years, you know. They're around a lot of new viruses so they are getting exposed to them the first time. So, if they put off vaccines every time they were sick, they would get really out of sync with their vaccines. So, none of those things are a contraindication for getting vaccines.

Host: That's very good advice. Now, this next one is something that we've heard for so many years, the color of your sputum or snot as it's called, in a cold tells you if it's bacterial or viral infection. Now I've heard that. I'm not sure if it's true or not, I've tended to believe it, but then I heard that it wasn't. Tell us about that one.

Dr. Kondis: Yes. This is one that always frustrates my friends who are in Primary Care Pediatrics, office-based pediatrics, because people will bring in their kids saying, oh, well it was clear, but now it's turned green. And that means it's bacteria. So, we need antibiotics. A lot of people think that if it's it's clear, it's a virus. And if it's a different color, it's bacterial and needs antibiotics. But actually that's not true. They have studied this as well and the color of the snot or the sputum can be really any color, yellow, green, clear if it's a viral infection or a bacterial infection.

And in fact, it can change color during the course of the infection because of the number of certain immune system cells and enzymes that those cells produce. So, actually, as your body's kind of ramping up fighting the infection, your snot will turn from clear to yellow or green. And that's actually a good thing because it means your body's fighting off the infection. It doesn't mean that you've developed some sort of serious bacterial infection or anything like that. So, you cannot tell what type of infection you have based on the color.

Host: Well, thank you for clearing that up. And as long as we're talking about viruses and colds, starve a fever, feed a cold. Now we just talked about chicken soup and vaccines and all of these things, these lovely things having to do with fever and colds. Is there any truth to that? Starving a fever, feeding a cold? I don't know. Even when I've had a fever, I'm hungry.

Dr. Kondis: That's right. And actually the starve a fever part is totally not true. I had to look this up to see when it started and it turned out in the 1500s people started saying that because back then fasting was prescribed as a therapy for lots of things. So, they would make people fast and they thought that would make their fever go away. But in fact, what we should be saying is feed a fever, feed a cold. It turns out better nutrition is just better anytime you're sick. So, when you have a fever, you should be encouraging food intake, liquid intake, you know, whatever you can handle. And when you have a cold, just like we talked about with the chicken soup. It's the nutrition from the soup is really helping your body fight off that infection. So, with any type of infection that your child has, you should be encouraging them to still be eating normally.

Host: Well, I do love talking about food and eating. So, let's hit on a few of those kinds of wives tales. Carrots can improve your eyesight. Now I mean, this one is nutritionally sound. Yes?

Dr. Kondis: Yes, so this is actually my favorite wive's tale that I did a little research on. So, the myth of carrots improving your eyesight, it turns out started during World War II and is based on a bit of truth because carrots are rich in beta carotene, which the body converts to a form of vitamin A called retinol. And that is a key molecule that's involved in maintaining normal vision. But it turns out, and I got this information from the carrot museum, which is a real place apparently in England, which I would love to visit someday. Cause I love carrots. So, during World War II, the British Royal Air Force developed radar for the first time to spot and shoot down enemy planes.

And they didn't want anyone to know that they had this new cutting edge technology. So, they started a rumor that the pilots ate lots of carrots, which allowed them to see better at night. And that's why they were able to shoot down so many planes. So, everybody started thinking, oh, if you eat all these carrots, you'll be able to have this amazing eyesight like these pilots. But it turns out you would have to eat so many carrots. I mean, just nothing but carrots really to have enough beta carotene to give you 20/20 vision. So, it's still a good idea to eat carrots. I mean, I feed my children lots of carrots. I think it's a great idea because they are very healthy. They are high in fiber. There's lots of good reasons to eat carrots, but it's not really going to give you better vision.

Host: Wow. Well, thank you for clearing that up and this research that you've done on these is so interesting. Now this is one again that I heard when my kids were little, putting cereal in a baby bottle helps them to sleep better. So, there's a lot of talk about this and contributing to obesity. You know, we've got this epidemic. Tell us a little bit about this cereal in the baby's bottle thing.

Dr. Kondis: Yes. This one has actually been studied as well. And kind of like a double-blind sort of study where babies were given cereal or not, and it turned out there was no benefit of putting cereal in the bottle to help babies sleep better. I think this one came up because the timeframe when people start to give baby cereal tends to be around six months and six months also just tends to be the age when a lot of babies start sleeping through the night.

So, I think people just equated the two. But you hit on a good point, which is obesity. And there's really no nutritional benefit of giving babies that extra cereal in the bottle. I mean, at six months you can start giving them table foods so you can start giving them like some cereal in the morning. You can start baby foods, things like that, but you don't need to be giving them those extra calories in the bottle. They should just be taking their formula like they have been, you know, the rest of their life. So, there's no benefit. And especially earlier than six months, because then it actually starts to be kind of a choking hazard. So, you really don't want to add anything to those bottles.

Host: Well, that's a good one to know. Now this next one, full disclosure. I have to admit my mother did with my little first son and my husband freaked. He's like, you can't do that. She's like, please I've had six kids. Yes, I can. But now I would not do this, is putting alcohol on a baby's gums to help them deal with teething pain. I remember her dipping her pinky into a glass of wine and rubbing it on little Clayton's gums. And I mean, it's just what they did and this was long ago, but we think of that now? I know what you're going to say.

Dr. Kondis: Yeah, so this one's pretty obvious what I'm going to say, but I actually did look this one up again to see when it started, because I had to figure out when people thought that this was ever a good idea. And apparently back in the 1800s, there was a very popular remedy called Mrs. Winslow's soothing syrup that people would buy for their children for teething. And it was basically just alcohol. And in fact, even carried a warning on the label that said, don't give the babies too much of this because it will harm their liver. So, even back then people recognized that alcohol was not good for you. Unfortunately, this has not been studied because there's no way you would do a study where you would give babies alcohol and some babies not, but we just know it's not a good idea.

And in fact, pretty much all of the teething remedies that are out there. There's a lot of homeopathic teething remedies on the market. None of them are actually good. It's really not a good idea to give babies who are teething at that age, you know, three months, four months, five months, six months, those early ages where they're teething. It's not a good idea to put anything on their gums because they're just too young at that age to have any sort of medications or tonics or honey or soothing or anything. They're too young for all of that. So, really the only thing we recommend for teething is just a teething ring, you know, a cold teething ring or a cold washcloth, or, something like that, that's a cold thing in their mouth. But nothing else. And honestly, I don't think the alcohol was really helping with the teething pain. I think it was just making the babies fall asleep probably.

Host: Well, I'm sure that probably contributes to it. And as long as we're on teething, does teething cause a fever or diarrhea?

Dr. Kondis: No, this has been studied. So, teething does cause some symptoms. It can cause a slight elevation in temperature. So, I think that's where the fever myth came from, but it shouldn't give you an actual fever, which we consider to be higher than 100.4, but it might take your baby up to like a 99 or 99.5 basically from the inflammation. It can also cause things like obviously drooling. Sometimes they don't want to eat because of the pain. They might develop a rash from the drooling, so you might see a rash on their neck or their chest. But basically that's it. It's not going to cause things like diarrhea, vomiting. So, if you're seeing those more severe symptoms, you should be thinking something other than teething is going on.

Host: That's really good advice. Now, before we wrap up, one of the ultimate top ones that we've ever heard in all of our lives of parenting mama wives tales, all of these things, don't go outside with a wet head or without a coat because you will get sick. And I remember being in high school oh, so many years ago. And you know, some girls would come to school having just washed their hair. And I was always jealous of them and they smelled really good. But then, you know, you had thought to yourself, well, they're probably going to get sick. Cause they went out in the winter and they had wet hair. But this is not really true. Is it?

Dr. Kondis: No. The short answer is no. And I used to always hear this from my mother, because I would always shower in the morning before school and not dry my hair. And she would freak out when I was out waiting for the bus that I was going to get sick. But no and I tried to figure this one out. I think the reason that it came up is just because you are going to get sick with a cold, if you're around more people. So, if you're going outside, you're not staying in your house. You know, you're probably going to be around more people and be exposed more viruses. There's over 200 viruses that can cause respiratory illnesses in the winter.

And none of them are associated with wet hair or not wearing a coat. Now I think wearing a coat is a good idea in the winter, just because if things are really cold, you might get frostbite. But that's not going to expose you to more viruses. So, I'm not really sure how that wet hair one came to be. Other than that, just maybe people who were washing their hair were maybe socializing more and being around other people more and picking up viruses that way.

Host: Well, that certainly is all great advice. Do you have any final thoughts that you would like to leave parents with Dr. Kondis in the fact that we hear these wives tales, we hear so many, you and I could go on for an hour and keep just going through these things, but these podcasts are not long. So, give us your final thoughts when we hear some of these myths, what do you advise us to do? And I know you're going to say, talk to your pediatrician.

Dr. Kondis: That's exactly what I'm going to say. You guessed it. You know, as pediatricians, we learn about a lot of these things in our practice. Sometimes we have to look up the origins, but we know the truth about whether or not they're true or not. And we are more than happy to discuss any of these. And I could think of about 10 more wives tales that we think of as well.

So, maybe we'll have to do a part two sometime. But we definitely have the right answers and we don't mind getting calls. Definitely call your pediatrician. If you have questions about any of these things. Cause we would much rather talk you through the right answer than have you try to guess or, you know, do your own research.

Host: I agree completely and our pediatricians, boy, we love them. They are there to help us raise our children and raise them safely. And you all are just doing amazing work. So, thank you so much for joining us today for this very fun episode. And that concludes another episode of Mom Docs with St. Louis Children's Hospital. For more advice like this and articles, check out the Mom Docs website at childrensmd.org/podcasts. Please also remember to subscribe, rate and review this podcast and all the other St. Louis Children's Mom Docs podcasts. Share this show with your friends and family, on social media, because a lot of these questions you're going to hear. So, if you share this information that we're getting from the experts at St. Louis Children's Hospital, we can all learn together. I'm Melanie Cole.